Art Startup Workshop: Advice for New and Struggling Art/Photo Businesses

Art Startup Workshop: Advice for New and Struggling Art/Photo Businesses


– First things first, let’s talk about what
we’re gonna cover today. The first thing I’m
gonna do is I’m gonna do, I’ve prepared a short
quick enough presentation. I’m gonna go through it pretty quickly without trying to go into rabbit holes so you guys can feel free to
ask questions after the fact. After that, Pat will give his commentary. We’ll chat about it maybe for a second or we may just go right into the questions but either way we’re gonna go right into the questions after that. The goal here is you guys. You guys are the focus here. I want to make sure that you guys get the help that you need and you get the questions
you need answered. Workshop for Art Startups. You are an art startup if you
just started your business, have sold less than $5,000 or so of art, combined offline and
online in the last year, or you’re just struggling to get traction. I said in my post guys, whether you’ve sold less then 10 pieces. Don’t get hung up on any
of these things here. It’s basically if you’ve
really just gotten started out and you’re struggling to get traction and you haven’t sold that
much in the last year then you’re basically like, you’re still just starting out. So this’ll apply to you. I know there’s a lot of other people that are on here too that wanted to join that are a little bit
past this stage perhaps. So I may say something
that applies to them but mainly this is gonna be for people that are in this stage. We will probably do something else for people at other stages after this. Let’s get started. The principles. You are a startup business, all right, and I say that in quotes, because I often hear people say, you think of yourself as an artist or a photographer or
maybe a starving artist. It’s a term that really bothers me. I won’t go into that, but I want to make the point that the same principles that apply to startup companies apply to you. All right? So when starting out, your only goal is to get
traction somewhere anywhere, and you don’t get to tell
the market what it wants. The market is gonna decide what it wants and you have to listen to it very closely and what I mean by that is, you might go out with your subject matter and you might try to sell it and you might be like oh gosh, I really hope that this content works. I really want to sell this and then you find out that that the market actually
wants something else. The market does not care
about what you want. It’s unfortunate, it’s sad, but it is what it is. The market decides what it wants, and you just really have to listen to it and when I work with a lot of you, I’m going to be deconstructing
as much as I can about where you’re having
any traction at all so we can figure out where that is and try to pour some gasoline on it. It’s not a time to be picky, when you’re in the startup phase, about what you’re willing to do or not willing to do. Sometimes I talk to people and they’re like I’m not gonna do shows. I’m just not gonna do them, and I sit and I’m scratching my head, and I’m going oh my gosh, have you ever ran a startup company? Obviously, no you haven’t, but if you’ve ever been
in the startup world, if you’ve ever been in that position, you realize that you cannot be picky about what you’re willing
to do or not willing to do. You have to do everything. Now here’s an important point because a lot of people think about it. They go I just don’t want
to be in the business of lugging myself around
to shows all year long or doing X, Y, or Z. It doesn’t matter what it is but they might be picky about something and what I say back is,
that doesn’t matter. If you do a couple shows to
figure out your business, you can hire somebody to
do those shows for you. You can hire an intern at a local college for $10 an hour or $12 an hour to do that show for you, but you might get more
sales in that one day and more qualified leads, than you did in the last year, and so you have to decide whether you want to do it or not, but at this stage as a startup, you’re not committing to anything yet. You’re not making a commitment for the next 10 years to do any
one particular thing, right? You’re just literally trying to figure out where you can get traction and where you can get feedback and figure out what the next steps are. The next thing is to look for
an advantage or an arbitrage. An example of this is if
you live in Austin, Texas, then if you are, let’s say you’re a
photographer in Austin, Texas, or you’re a painter in Austin, Texas, you have an, your local advantage is that you know the imagery, you know the times of day, the lights, the angles. You know what the secret spots are. You have an advantage by living here that every other photographer or artist in the country does not have. I’m giving that as one example but look for an advantage
or an arbitrage, always. It’s gonna make the world smaller for you. You just need to get your product in front of the right people and generate qualified leads, the number one metric, and make sales. In order to generate qualified leads you have to just generate leads. Again, if I give the example of getting out in person
and doing some shows, or going to a farmer’s market or whatever it is to get out in person, you’re obviously hoping to make sales. You want to make sales, number one, but you have to collect leads. You’re gonna collect somewhere between 20, 30, sometimes more times the amount of leads than you will sales. It’s kind of crazy. If you do five to 10 sales at a show, you might get 100 emails,
100 leads from that show, and of that, 70% to 80% of them might actually be qualified, and why that’s so important is you’ve gotta fill up
your sales funnel, right? You guys are all operating a real business with a sales funnel. You put the leads through the top, and some sales come out the bottom. The reason that lead
generation is so important for every business, is because nobody is just
ready to buy right on the spot. That applies to almost any company. Like remember Art Storefronts, I’m gonna guess that at some point we got your email address
before you became a member and you subscribed to our blog, or you subscribed to our podcast. That’s lead generation, and then eventually you
put in a demo request. Like it takes a lot of time, right? So it all starts out with beginning the relationship on the simplest level and then maybe sometime down the road if it’s a good fit, you might buy, so you have to make sure that you’re generating qualified leads. Now if you are doing something and you make a few sales and you’re generating some leads, you’re starting to get traction. That’s a really really good thing. That’s what you’re looking for. So never forget the importance of collecting leads everywhere. This is one of the biggest
mistakes I have found. It’s a pattern. I’ve actually just recorded a separate video on this, because it’s really kind of blown my mind but with all the different photographers and artists that we’re
advising here and talking to I have noticed that whether
it’s on their website with the lead capture tool or whether it’s at art shows, or whether it’s anywhere in person, people are not thinking
about collecting leads. This is a very important
business principle. Everyone’s making this mistake, or 90% of the people
are making this mistake. What I mean is, they might be making
sales at a co-op gallery, but they’re not collecting leads there, even though they can. They’re making sales at art shows but they’re not collecting leads so you’re just leaving
so much on the table and you’re not giving yourself
the building blocks to grow. The digital approach to
generating qualified leads and starting to get traction. When you’re starting from scratch, trying to find traction digitally can work but just know it usually takes much longer than getting out in person. Be ready for the long haul. I’m speaking to those of you who are literally just starting out and you’re hoping that you
can just sit behind a computer and turn a few knobs and do a few things and you’re gonna learn all
the lessons about your niche. You’re gonna learn all the lessons about the demographics of your customer, and you’re gonna learn everything and you’re gonna be able to scale it and just the sky’s the limit. That is going to take a
long time and be very hard. You will learn more by getting
out in person in one day, than you probably, if you’ve been at this for a bit, you will learn more than
you probably have in a year of sitting behind your computer. There’s just something to it. Now why do I say this? This is just a principle in startups. In building startup companies, right? You get out in person. You talk to people. You ask them questions. Hey, why did you like this image? Why do you connect with
this subject matter? Why do you like it? You observe people as
they come to your booth, without even saying anything sometimes and you notice that people are just going towards
one piece of content or one style of content. That’s the market telling you that something’s resonating. So when you’re also at this point, when you’re starting out, you want to have a very
aggressive mentality guys, and I’m saying I.E. do a
ton of creative giveaways. The giveaways as you know are a great way of generating leads, and some people have asked me, well they generate a
lot of vanity leads too. Like not qualified leads, and I said yes, but if they generate 10 qualified leads and let’s say 90 general leads, I want to ask you, how many qualified leads
did you get last week, and what was the ROI on this giveaway for what you got for it? So what matters is, the fact that you got
the 10 qualified leads not the 90, and I’m just coming up with those numbers out of the blue. I’m not saying that those are accurate. I think they’re actually much higher, but don’t worry about making huge profits at this point guys. This is all a marketing expense. Normally, it costs money to
acquire leads and customers. If you can break even or
make a little profit early on and your list is growing,
you are actually winning. So this is an important point. When you’re doing giveaways, or you’re doing that type of
stuff and it’s really early, of course, you don’t want
to be losing money, right? You want to make a little bit of money, but I just want to make this point, because acquiring customers
usually costs money, and so you take your giveaway and you divide it by the number of leads that you generated, and that’s
your cost per lead, right? Or cost per sale, if you divide it by the
number of customers. That’s your customer acquisition cost otherwise known as CAC, but when you are early on, you want to be just really aggressive like be aggressive with price. Be aggressive with the giveaway. Don’t hold back. You’re just trying to get traction. You’re not trying to build
and scale the business yet. You have a serious advantage
that you should use and I just want to make sure
you guys are aware of this. Your cost on a print is so little yet you can give it away
with a big price tag, or if you’re a painter, and you have originals stacked up, in your garage or somewhere, use those. They are huge leverage. Like if you have an original painting that you normally would charge $1,000 or $1,500 for and these thing are
collecting dust for years, give away one of those, because if you do a
giveaway for $1,000 piece, think about how much more
attention that’s gonna get and the people that’s gonna attract. Now when I talk about the prints for the rest of you that
are giving away prints, you can buy a paper print. I think there’s a huge advantage on like fine art paper prints. Your cost is so low, and you can mark them up so high, and like you can get
creative with how you do that but it costs you so little that you can do some really big ones and just kind of get crazy with it. Like maybe you have a
big one that’s framed and it costs you $80, but you’ve now got a price tag, like this is a $750 piece I’m giving away or $1,000 piece, and it gives you that much
more leverage on your giveaway. Utilize your advantages and
I believe that the prints, even if you do them in person, even if you have some sort of a way of doing a two for
one or whatever it is, just realize that you can leverage that and you always want to leverage the things that you have advantages with. The goal here is just to get your art, your name, your product, in front of as many people as possible and a point here I want to make is doing a bunch of SEO website work right here at this time is
absolutely the wrong move. You don’t know what sells yet. You may need to pivot your business model, or your entire website strategy and that’s aside from the fact that in 2020 SEO is gonna provide an extremely low ROI,
return on investment, on your time if you get any return at all. That is a subject for a
whole ‘nother discussion. SEO is search engine optimization for those of you who don’t know. The digital approach
alone may not work for you and your content if
you’re just starting out. If it doesn’t work, or
you lose your patience, get out in person. It’s the most important point I can make. Don’t just sit there and
do social media posts and follow the Art Marketing Calendar and go, it’s not working for me. It’s not working for me. If you don’t have traction, and you didn’t come in
with traction already, you gotta do something else, and the fastest way is
to get out in person but you gotta do something else. You gotta try some other methods, and we’ll get into that too. The in person approach, when you’re starting from scratch doing things in person is far easier because of how quickly you
get can get your product in front of people, and
you can do it today, or this weekend. Now when I say this guys, your actual product, there’s such a big difference between people seeing
your prints in person, like in real life, and the power of that, versus like you just posting it online, and often times as you guys know, most of the time you guys have been posting images of your work and not holding a print or doing a video of the print. Close up, side views,
and things like that, and you definitely want to be doing that because you need to
merchandise the product as much as possible so these people know what they’re gonna buy and how cool it is, but when you’re in
person, it’s just so much, everybody grasps it right on the spot, and so instantly, as people are walking by you have leads walking
in front of your booth. You’ve got prospects, walking in front of your booth or wherever you’re at, and the people that come in, you can actually get them to become leads and they actually see your
product which is amazing, and you can observe them and
all of those types of things. Even though it seems like
a lot more work to do shows I assure you it is not
if you calculate the ROI, the return on investment
again, on your time spent. The amount of time that you’re spending behind the computer wasting months and months and months of time potentially, if you get out in one day
and probably do a show and sell $500 to $1,000. You do that four times in a month, you have $4,000 in sales, just like that, and now you have the seeds from which to grow your digital business. So there’s no faster way
to make sales in person than in person, build
a qualified lead list, ask questions and get real
feedback and find your niche. Learn to love it. This alone will be a massive advantage and I’ll get into that too. If you think you have a niche problem just get out in person as much as possible and let the market tell you what it wants. You can only solve a niche problem by talking to customers or
observing their behavior. Like if 50% or more of your sales come from one specific subject matter. So test everything and run
tests often and quickly when you are in this position. I want you guys to try
everything that you can to generate leads and to get traction. Generate every idea you can, both online and offline and test them all. Your goal is to get your
product in front of people, see if you can generate
qualified leads or sales, don’t spend a lot of money or time on any one specific thing. No over thinking. No big purchases or commitments. No perfectionist mentality. For example, I was speaking
to a photographer and he said, well, I wasn’t just
ready to go spend $10,000 and have a booth yet, and I said, no, no, no, no, no. You do not go spend
$10,000 and get a booth. You go buy a table at Costco for $75.00 or whatever you can get one used, drape a skirt over it or whatever, get some prints made of what you think your bestsellers are, or what your friends and family tell you your best sellers are and get out in person, but do not make any big
purchases or commitments. Just get out there and just
do it kind of raw and dirty. We all want the easiest thing to work. Usually the easiest thing to do that everyone can do and is doing will not work or it will have a low ROI. So what I mean here is
that sometimes people, they start their business, and they had this idea in their mind. They were romanticizing
about it, like SEO. Like I’m just gonna launch this site. I’m just gonna do some search
engine optimization work and that’s it, right, and they get really hung up on it, and when it doesn’t work they get really emotionally beat down, and so when it doesn’t work, don’t get upset about it. Move on and try something else. You gotta try other things. Getting emotionally invested
in any single tactic is a sure path to misery and many people will actually just give up because they think they failed, but in reality, this is just
normal startup business. This is just the way that it goes. You gotta try things. You don’t know what’s gonna work and what works is gonna
be different for everyone and when you find something that works, in other words, you have done something that is generating
qualified leads and sales, that’s when you focus on
it and you double down. I need you guys to
appreciate how hard it is to get traction in any startup business from any single marketing channel, and don’t allow yourself
to get distracted from it. Ask yourself instead, have you fully exploited this channel that is working yet? Before you deviate and
move on to anything else and in this process, if you can’t get traction, you may very well decide to
change your subject matter. This is called a pivot
in the startup business, and there’s nothing wrong with it. Some of our most successful
members actually pivoted. Meg Mackenberger. William K. Stittum. Two people that are some
of the biggest sellers on our platform, they both pivoted. So don’t feel bad about that either. You may have to pivot. You may not want to, but you may have to pivot, and choose a different subject matter where you have an advantage and where you have a really solid market. That’s where you end up
if things don’t work. If you just can’t get traction with the subject matter
you currently have. That’s the last step. You try something else and you fix the problems, right? Obviously your other content didn’t work because there wasn’t a market for it and you have no advantage
or whatever it was. Now is your chance to pick something that actually works. I’m giving you guys this example. This is a brewery. One of these ranch brewery properties in Austin Texas called
Treaty Oak Distillery and it’s like probably, I’d say, about 20 minutes or so from downtown. It’s a beautiful spot, and I was there with my family, about three weekends ago. Three or four weekends ago,
and I took a picture of this. This is my picture. At this place, this brewery distillery had about 500 people there during the day, all families, great people, great crowd. Definitely like a middle
class and up type of a crowd, and there were these boots here. So I took a picture of it and the thing that drove me crazy here is that you could see, this guy was selling a book. This guy was selling birdhouses. I think this was jewelry and my wife spent $200 here. These people had patrons going
by their booths all day long because people go to this
ranch and they hang out and they kind of spend three,
four, five hours there, with other families and
friends, and things like that, and there’s a ton of
these in Austin right now but the thing that stood out to me is, we’re in Austin, Texas. This is not a small city. Why didn’t a single artist or photographer have a booth here? It just blows my mind. There are opportunities
here all over the place and they’re just being
completely overlooked and I believe, and this was going back to one of the points I was making earlier that I said I would come back to, is that if you actually
get out there guys, you’re gonna have a massive advantage. If you actually get out there, these people are out there hustling, and there’s not a single competitor that’s an artist or a photographer. You could have been the only one. You could have got your eyeballs in front of 500 people at least that day and probably made some sales, had a great time doing
it, talking to people, and probably got 100
qualified leads on your list and so I want to encourage you guys to be thinking about this, because it’s not that hard, and you can do this too. These people aren’t any
more talented than you. They are just getting
out there and hustling. Do what the other people
are not willing to do and you will have very little competition. Everybody asks me, hey there’s so many
landscape photographers on Fine Art America and all these places, yes, there are. Stay away from those places. Everywhere where the
competition is extremely high yes, you are right. It is hard to differentiate yourself. So go everywhere else but there. That’s where you’re going
to have the advantage, where you will be the only person in front of 500 people
every single weekend, and these places are all over the place. There’s farmer’s markets in every city, in every neighboring city. There are breweries and
properties like this. There are upscale hotels. All of these places are opportunities. While other people are
sitting behind a computer waiting for the world to come to them, these people that I just showed you are out there making real sales talking to real customers, moving their businesses forward. Art shows, local festivals,
farmer’s markets, breweries, wineries, upscale
hotels, office buildings, parks, office parks, food truck roundups. Wherever. There’s tons of places
where this stuff is going on every single weekend. You can do it too. You just gotta find them and hustle. There’s digital ways to do this too. Although they’re not as
effective as I mentioned. It’s not as easy when you’re not in person but things like Facebook groups
and Instagram influencers. Instagram influences. I mean finding people that have a large following on Instagram that might be able to share your work or share your giveaway. When you’re running a giveaway, and if they have qualified people, if you believe qualified
people are following them, then those people might just turn into qualified leads for you and you can do this by
giving them an offer. Maybe you pay them $50 or $75, I’ve heard. Meg Mackenberger told me
in a recent phone call that she paid an Instagram influencer and ended up selling like
five limited editions from it. So the opportunities are there. Again, what’s gonna work for you is gonna be different for other people but these are all things
that you can do right away to start generating more qualified leads. Next you guys, I want you
to get the help you need to keep moving forward. I do not want you guys stuck. All small businesses, especially
startups, hit roadblocks. The only thing that is certain is that you’re going
to get stuck somewhere. Something is not going
to work at some point. This is for every startup
in every industry. It always happens. We built Art Storefronts
to get entrepreneurs the help they need to work
through their problems and to keep the business moving forward. This is something I dreamed of having when building my own companies
over the last 20 years. I dreamed of having this guys and I built it for you and we’re improving it every day for you so that you as startups
have what I never had and what I always needed and what I wanted and what I had to just go
pull out of other people and it was the biggest pain in the world. You’re an ASF member which means you get marketing and
business consulting for life. For life! Realize what that means. You have experts at
your disposal right now. Realize how amazing this is and how much this normally costs. Use it. The only way you are sure to lose, sure to not get your money’s worth is if you don’t use it. Don’t be the person who gives up and goes dark when in reality your business is just stuck on something. You’re usually stuck on one thing guys, and if you can verbalize what’s going on and we can help you, we will help you. We want to help you. I really want you guys to use it. I’m sure you guys can see
the passion in my voice. It pains me to think of anybody out there that is stuck, that is
totally stuck somewhere, and doesn’t know what to do and doesn’t know what the next move is and so we’ve gotta get you help. So ASF’s history in a nutshell here. We set out to build phenomenal
art selling websites but we discovered that
photographers and artists are just a huge group of
struggling entrepreneurs that need help. So fixing broken or
struggling art startups is actually the real problem. Guys, you don’t have a website problem. You don’t have a problem with
any tool that you’re using. You’ve got marketing
and business problems. That’s it. That is the whole thing. The reason that you don’t have traction. The reason that you’re not
getting to the next level that you want to get to, is because you have business problems and those business problems
have to get worked through. We put together some key
resources for you for after this. I want you guys if you haven’t already to make sure you’ve read
the ASF Member Handbook. We recently created this a
few weeks ago for all members and the purpose is to
help explain everything and to make sure that you are
thinking about your business and what you should be
doing the right way. I want you all to watch my presentation on The #1 Metric for Art Businesses. We’ve put together a list of ways to generate qualified leads. A master list, which is awesome. Some of you are probably thinking, yeah, but how do I generate
more qualified leads? Obviously, I talked
about some of those ways, but we’ve put together a list and we’re building upon it every single day right now, and we’re gonna continue
to just compile this awesome master list for ASF members, based on what you guys have told us for what we’ve learned ourselves so that it’s just one big collaboration of what’s been working for everybody and again, you just gotta
pick and choose off that list. Just try different things, and hopefully something
is gonna work for you. When you do anything in person, follow the Art Show Playbook. We will link that in as well and you can apply the lead
capture principles there to everything that you do in person. Listen to our customer calls. This is a new thing that we started doing specifically the ones with
Ron, Judith, and Julie. I think these will resonate with you guys because Patrick and I were advising them on how to think about
their business as a startup and what their next moves were and whenever you get stuck, ask questions, and get help and small wins guys. That’s where it begins. It’s not a social community. This is the venue we have created that makes it easier for us to help you work on your business, and I say this to any of you that are out there that are like I do not want to be on Facebook. I will tell you guys this. I don’t want to be on Facebook either. You probably realize I’m not using a personal Facebook account. I do not use Facebook whatsoever for my personal life or
my family or anything. It is a venue just to operate the small wins group for this business. So for those of you who
don’t want to be on Facebook, awesome, just use it as a tool as well, the same way that I am, so that you can get all
the value from this. Also we’re gonna have
this startup workshop as I mentioned at the beginning probably once a month. Maybe more frequently, and instead of having a lot
of presentations like this it’s gonna be a lot more like discussion with you guys directly. I want to talk to you. We want to talk to you. So if your business is stuck or stalled, as you start working on these things and you need help, that means you should attend. Stay tuned, the schedule
will be released soon. Thank you. Pat, I will stop the share, and kick it back to you. You are muted right now. – Yeah, thank you. I just took the host back. For those that know how to use Zoom that want to ask a question I think we’re gonna just
do the raised hand thing. You should see it in your right hand bar, but if you’ve got a question, if you raise your hand, it’ll show me the raised hand icon and then I’ll just start
unmute you one at a time. Assuming there’s no audio issues, let’s just say one question, one answer, to try to give everybody. Yeah, you’re literally raising your hand. I love it. There’s a digital one. There’s a digital version. It’s over on the right hand side bar. Click around and you’ll see
a thing that says raise hand. – Do you want to do the
side by side video too of us or is that possible? – I’m not sure what’s on what under what. – I’m just seeing you. – Yeah, I think you just
gotta tweak your views. – Oh okay. Well yeah. – Let’s get into it. Whose ready for the first question or maybe we should just have. Okay, I got the first one. – What did you think in general? First thoughts. Do you have any
comments, right off the bat? – Yeah, I think there was a lot to digest in one presentation. I think the next level of real value is gonna come out of the
Q and A that we have. I would add to everything that you said, we built this business, and it’s had this iteration, where it started with a website, and then you start
talking to your customers and you realize hey, a
website’s not enough, and so we start getting into
the marketing aspects of it and it’s like hey, you need to demystify and boil the technical elements out to the best possible. I know that’s really hard
to do and then we get there. Now it’s like we need to continue to give as much education and coaching on growing your business as possible and the part about
startup, no one says that. You’re a small business owner. You are a startup, and we want you to make
the amount of money that you have set out for yourself and I think another huge and key way that a lot of people don’t
necessarily think about or get hung up on is just one
particular revenue source. If you just have originals, you’re just selling originals. If it’s just prints, you think you’re gonna
just be selling prints. When you want to find
as many revenue sources for your business as you can, treat each one as an individual silo and work on growing them all in tandem, but we’ll get into that more. I’m gonna start with the first question. Steve, you’re the first
hand that I’ve seen raised so I’m gonna go ahead and unmute you. Let’s see how it works. Steve, you’re good to go. – [Steve] Can you hear me? – Yes. – [Steve] Great. Thanks. This has been a great talk. I’ve been trying to do
this for a long time so I really appreciate you guys
taking the time to do this. I really have two questions. One of them, I’m doing a
trade show in two weeks and what got me on this
call in the first place was I guess I’m not very
good at chatting people up and remembering what
they are and who they are and what categories they need to do, so is there a resource that says, a checkbox that says, I mean obviously male,
female, age, pretty easy, but it seems like I’m having
a hard time figuring out when I look at the art
or the sales funnel. I got stuck on whose my customer. I’m doing shows for a year or two actually more than that collecting names. I have 300 names on my mailing list. – Good job. – Generally, thanks. Generally I know kind of who they are and I start going through that list but with the show coming up I was hoping is there a better way for me to? – Let me ask you Steve, normally when I’m doing
this type of stuff, when I’m in this position, I mean it’s really just
like very actively observing and like the pattern will emerge. It’s not necessarily like you have to be totally scientific about it. There should be some sort of a trend. I mean like let me ask you, do you notice any sort of patterns? – [Steve] Yeah, I have. I think I’ve noticed, because my art is more
on the sensual side. It’s female form kind of stuff. That’s why I was trying
to reach out to Bill because he pivoted off that kind of stuff but I’ve noticed, yeah,
there’s a certain gender, certain age range, and a certain personality
that goes along with it. I just wonder if there’s
a way that I could, that’s what I’ve seen so far. I guess I’m doing it the right way then by doing shows, and just generally writing
on the back of the card what I thought of this person. – The writing on the back of the card is a very great, that’s a great tactic. I’ve been doing that for years. That’s a good idea, but I think you do have a general idea. Pat, do you have anything to add? – Yeah, I mean there’s a couple of things. One you’re doing the shows, which is the right idea. Two, you’re building up the funnel but three, I get being a little timid and not wanting to talk to people but my goodness, the best part, the best part of having
this in person experience of doing a show is how
much feedback you can get and you don’t realize how
much feedback you can get when somebody walks away. Just when they walk away. Do not let them walk away. When somebody comes into the store and I’ll tell a very brief story on this because I think it’s a
good, sets the context, but when Nick and I were younger, we actually had a
clothing company together and we ended up meeting this guy outside of a fabric warehouse and he ended up working for us and he taught us so many valuable lessons. It’s insane. We would drive on to Melrose. Melrose was a street in L.A. back then where all the hottest
clothing stores were. We would park right out in front of. He goes come in guys. Let’s watch this. We would
walk right into the store and he would walk up to every
single solitary employee, and he goes, show me
what’s selling the most. Show me what’s selling the
most in here right now. What is the hottest item? Why do you think it’s the hottest item? Whose buying it more? Is it women buying it for men? Is it men buying it for themselves? What do they say about it? What’s getting returned the most? That employee’s done. Over to the next employee and we would do this for eight hours at all of the various different shops and you come out of it and you’re like oh my gosh, the amount of feedback I have. So how do you apply it to art? When these people come up to your booth, start the conversation. Start the relationship. What caught your eye particularly? Was it this piece or that piece? Why? What caught your eye about it? That’s interesting. What art have you bought
in the last six months? Did you buy it or did your wife buy it and even if they’re gonna leave and they’re not gonna give you anything and they’re gonna walk on, you get those extra data points and it’s like you turn the ROI os a show, and it’s so much higher in that capacity and that’s a discipline in and of itself, but it’s such a fantastic way to learn and especially early on
when you’re like okay, everyone tells me I’m great at art. I’ve got these amazing pieces, but I’m not getting traction. It’s not selling because
I haven’t found my niche. So I’ll start asking questions about what they did
buy, and what’s selling, and what their wife really likes and why and what you might stumble upon is some hot new niche that’s coming up that you can tailor your
art to very very easily, and so I think that’s a big one too. – Well Steve. – [Steve] Obviously, I have on my card that they fill out for the giveaway, it says what caught your eye. That’s very much what
you just said I think. – Yeah, so you’re doing it. You’re doing great. Okay, Steve. I’m gonna meet you. – Let me give him one more. Steve, let me give Steve one more thing. Steve, another thing for you is, I understand that it can
be a little nerve wracking to question these people especially if you’re a
little timid about it, but what I’ll tell you is the people that are buying from you, you have to ask them first. They’re already your customer. When the deal is done, you can ask them, and then after that, focus on the people that are kind of spending a little bit more time than usual in your booth. You don’t have to hound people who just walked in there. So people who look like they’re
kind of going back and forth from one thing or the other
or flipping through things, you can talk to them as well, but the other thing too is be yourself. Don’t be afraid to just be like, hey, you know what? I’m just really trying. I’d love to ask you guys.
I’m really trying to learn who the people are who like my art because they’re always coming in and they’re buying it and I’d love to hear
what you like about it or what about it you’re connecting with. You take it in that type of a way. Be real candid. Be yourself, and you’re gonna learn a ton. Usually people will be
thrilled to help you and help you learn what it is. – Good, next question. Mark,
I saw you had your hand up. I’m gonna unmute you. You good to go? – Yeah. I raised my hand. I didn’t know how to raise my hand. – I caught you. I saw you. – Nice Mark. – You guys talk about shows and everything and I’m all hesitant because Nick says, I’ve spoken to a lot of
my fellow photographers and they invest in small stuff and little cards and calendars and spent almost $1,000 to do this show and then if they don’t sell it, then they’re out with all the stuff sitting in their basement, so I’m a little hesitant doing that. So I’ve been doing four venues. I’ve done four galleries. One of which being accepted to the Minnesota State Fair, a very prestigious photography venue, and zero, no inquiries, nothing. So maybe this is telling
me galleries don’t work. So maybe I’ve gotta
force myself to do shows. I don’t know, but then I’ve got to mount all these little pictures on foam core, get a whole inventory. – What kind of work do you do? – Landscape photography. I just took this one. This is an under water shot. It’s nothing big. – Where have you sold before? – I haven’t. I give away most of my work actually. The giveaway, that went really quick. – We all know that. I’m glad you brought this up, because the galleries didn’t work, but we know that
galleries work in general, but like it just didn’t work for you. Like some things work for some people. Some things don’t work for others. It’s also depends on the
gallery, the location, and all that stuff. It’s okay, the qualified
leads or whatever, if they even had any
that were going in there. Who knows? They might not be
getting a lot of traffic. I don’t really know, or you might have been
in a really bad location within the gallery. Who knows what it could be, but the bottom line is, it didn’t work, so when it comes to the doing an art show or something else in person, like a farmer’s market, like all these different types of things, I see them around. I was just telling Pat
yesterday, I have to say it, because I showed the
brewery on the presentation. There’s another place here in Austin called The Galleria in Lakeway and I know there’s some
people in Austin on this call. So they have a farmer’s
market literally every weekend and there’s all these booths there and it’s a classy spot. This is a nice shopping center. I mean there’s $3 million homes
within a mile of this place and again, there’s all the booths. There’s the farmers that are there and there’s some artisans and then there’s a popcorn stand and everybody there had these dirty tables and a little tent that
you could buy on Amazon and that was it for the most part and so I was like I can’t believe this. There was a band playing. There was all these families there. Tons of people walking around. So I went and I looked it up online and it costs $40 to go to this place and yet, there wasn’t a single artist or a photographer there. So what I would say is, when you’re thinking
about going in person, dip your toe in. Find a way to dip your toe in. If you’ve gotta buy like, all photo luster paper prints because they’re really cheap. You can buy those things really cheap. You can also buy economy canvas. You can buy the economy metal
from Graphic Dimensions. Don’t worry about it. You’re not gonna ruin your brand. You’re in the very beginning. You haven’t sold anything yet. You can get these things way cheaper and then just test it. It’s just a test. Can you go there, and then be aggressive with your offering, like hey, at this show
I’m offering 30% off, so raise your prices up, but make it seem like
you’re giving them a deal for being at that show. You know what I mean? So don’t spend $1,000. Just spend. Look at what you can do, and just kind of hack your way and spend the least amount that you can to have something and walk away from it and with the goal of being breakeven or a little bit ahead, but to leave with a bunch of leads, and a lot of information and learnings from what happened there. Some weird things happen sometimes. Sometimes people like only
the metal prints sell. With some people’s content. It’s like whoa, why did that happen? It’s like, I can’t explain it. 20 prints sold on metal and then one sold on canvas. I guess metal really
resonates with my imagery and so then you’ll go to the next show, and you’ll come with
all metal or 90% metal and then your sales double or triple. So you just gotta figure out a way to dip your toe in for the
least investment possible. That goes for any tactic. – Okay, so just elaborating. You guys are pushing shows and all that. Do you guys have any way of the best way to set up a booth and make it look nice instead of just? I mean do you really suggest
just a table from Costco a white tablecloth and just
spreading your artwork out? I mean, really? – Look as an entrepreneur, I am very. I’ve started six companies and I’ve gotten to the point where I will, Pat will criticize this a little bit because he tends to be a
lot more quality oriented. I’m like, ship it! Ship it, ship it, ship it! Which just means, look
I’ve learned enough to know that when you do one thing
you can’t ruin your brand. You can’t do anything wrong. Look the best you can. It’s up to you, but if you don’t want
to spend a lot of money you can make yourself look pretty good without spending a lot of money. We do have resources for this. We’ve got an art show playbook that has all sorts of stuff in it and it should link to a post in the Small Wins group, where everybody collaborated and was posting pictures of their booths and stuff like that and they were talking about
what booths they bought. What the brand names were and I think that would
be pretty helpful for you but I think the important
point I want to say is it sounds like we’re pushing shows. We’re actually just pushing
getting out in person. Like when I started Art Storefronts, I went and I got in
front of photographers. I didn’t sit online and
just throw up some ads. I went to real well known
photographers and I sat down and I said, I want you to look at this. Tell me what you think about this website. Would you buy this? Will you put a down payment for it, because I don’t want to start this company unless you would, and I got 20 of those people to actually say I will buy it right now and I said I’ll give you the
best deal ever for your life. Like you pay me $50 for
this right now or $100. I forget what it was, and I will give you a license, and you’ll be good to go, and that’s where I went wow, there’s a real problem here. You see what I mean? It’s just hard to not do. It’s so much harder to do when you are not in person. You’re just gonna get way more feedback. I don’t want to harp on the shows. The shows happen to be a good way but it’s just getting in person, like the brewery, right? That’s just as dirty as it comes. That lady on the end, if you remember, where my wife spent $200, she sat a table. That’s all she had. – I would say a couple of things and thanks for the question. I unmuted you. Dana, you’re gonna be next. I would say one, when
you’re big shiny booth or just a table, if you can find the opportunities the cheaper shows where
I see stand in the groups like a lot of people are saying my local art fair is $2,000, so you have to find some
of the more fringe ones that are cheaper, and don’t cost as much, and it’s like if you
spend $40 or $50 or $100, you go down there with some prints. Maybe they’re gonna work. Maybe they’re not gonna work. Attempt to fire sale them at the end. Gather as many contacts as you can. It’s just a really high
revenue opportunity especially when you find the cheaper under the radar, and Ron knows use festivalnet.com. I know that’s one as well, but all it takes is just going
around your local community, seeing where somebody has a booth set up for whatever it is, and saying hey, can I get in here, and get in there, and look, if you don’t want to be on your feet for eight hours, go for two. Go for two. Fire sale everything you
have at the very end of it. You don’t like it for that price, what would you take it for?
Because it might just be saying this particular subject material that you’re using here is not working. It is not great for. – Or buy one get one free. – Okay, going to Dana. Dana, over to you. You’re unmuted. – Hey, how you doing? Thanks you guys for putting this together. I appreciate it, and I’m kind of a classic example of exactly what you guys
were addressing today. I think I climbed on the platform probably a year ago, went whole hog. Did the whole Facebook,
Instagram, giveaway thing, and it flopped, and I basically, it’s been idle ever since then. So I’m definitely guilty of not going down the show path. Kind of resisting it for
the financial reasons, much like everybody else. I think just my work the
way I want to present it tends to be expensive, and it’s making that initial investment in the show inventory
that has had me struggling but again, between this,
and your metric video, which I actually watched this morning, between the two of those, I now have a sense of what I need to do next
to move things forward but really my main question was, so thanks for everything. My main question is where we can access the assets that you talked about. The new handbook and the
lead generation list? – Pat, where will those be? Will those just go in the vault? – Yeah, I imagine. – We will post it on the same thread and we’ll make sure you
guys all see it for sure, but it’ll live somewhere. – We’ll email it to you
after this thing’s over. – We’ll email it. – Perfect. Thanks guy. – Yeah, Eason you’re next. I hope I said that right. You should be unmuted now. Go ahead. – Thanks so much. I can see your enthusiasm. I can see your passion. I am inspired by you guys. Bless your hearts. Really really. Its amazing to see this
amazing support group and all of this over here. I really really appreciate
what you’re doing. – You’re welcome. – Thank you. Just a small little. I have two questions that come to my mind as I’m thinking. First of all, this is amazing. This is what it is doing, and this is happening more and more if that time permit. This is very inspiring. This really really means
that you guys care about us and you really want us to succeed and I appreciate that. I personally, I create artwork
to inspire global peace and for the last 17 years I’ve been working on making a half an acre size of a painting made of 2,000 paintings, and I’m being on this production site. I’m in Orange County. Somewhere Orange county and right now there’s a park here. The city is very interested
to do this whole installation. – Irvine Great Park or what? – Yes, you’re aware of it? – Yeah. I live in orange county too. – Oh wonderful, yes. – I’m from Orange county originally. – Wonderful, wonderful. Yeah, I started this whole project in 2003, 9/11 all of this happened. I was just moved. Oneness. We are one people. Unity is the answer, and I created all of these flags and abstract faces in
2,000 link them together you will see a gigantic peace symbol and love and unity through there. Now the two things that
going on in my mind, just gonna make it short, I have an art studio. I have some benefactor that helped me, spend over half million, and now I am didn’t work out, and I’m taking care of everything myself and we never ended up doing any marketing. We spent so much money in production, capturing, imaging. Almost thousands of paintings that have been fine art captured, but none spent. For the last year I started doing marketing on find guys over summer and I’m just in love with the website. Everything that you support. Now the website, I have a shopping cart, and I’m working full time. Family business, construction. Morning to night. Just to pay the bills. That’s where I am. Two questions. One questions. Where do they start? Business schedule. What do you recommend and the next thing is, this beautiful setup in my art studio as kind of a gallery as well, and there’s a story, and there’s a lot of people
with money around here. You go to Newport Beach. – Where exactly you are? – I’m in Laguna Nigel. – Laguna Nigel, okay. Of of Kern valley. – Yes. That’s what five years. We captured all of those arts and we created more paintings. What I’m seeing it would be amazing to find a way to attract people to come and just give them a tour. Anybody come down give a tour. – Are you in a business center down there or are you in a shopping center? – Do you know where the Costco is? – Yes I do. Right off of five? – Yeah. The road before Costco make
a left by Metro station. That’s where I have been
over five years now, and for the first thing on my mind is how can I expose
myself to attract people? Maybe do local SEO, or just people coming to my tour, and the next question is, what do you recommend
to business schedule? How should I start? – Well there’s a lot there. I mean. – No SEO. – No SEO. No SEO. – No SEO? – No SEO. Get out in person. You’ll do more in one day than you will in SEO for a year or two. I mean it’s just crazy, but Pat, what would you? Let me ask you this? – The exact same advice applies. Number one, it sounds like, probably you have more inventory at this juncture than
any human being alive. I would take some of the best. I would get out, do a local show, and start building your list. I mean that’s it. You’re right. You’re in an
extremely affluent neighborhood. You have a lot of
opportunities in small deals. You’re always gonna be
working during the week so the side hustle is gonna have to be doing a show on a weekend. Take the best of the
best and tell your story. You’ve got a good story there that people will connect with. Don’t over think it, and do exactly what we recommended. – Yeah, get out there and
collect leads like crazy because then once you
get all those emails, you can then have an event at your place but you’ve got the leads. You’ve got the qualified leads and you can say hey, we’re
having a wine appetizer opening here and the artist
is gonna be here signing or whatever you want to do, but if you get out there, you’re gonna get out
in front of the leads. You know Laguna. Like I mean you’re in the prime time, and I would say look
at San Diego up to L.A. Look at Manhattan Beach. Everywhere that you can get out and try to get in some places. Dip your toe in and see
where you can get traction. That’s what I would do, and here’s the other thing, and it applies for everybody, and myself included, Nick
included, and it’s hard. We have this tendency to say okay, I’m gonna go ahead and try it once and we’ll see how it goes, and it doesn’t go and you quit. I’m not doing that again. I’m done. I’m over it. I tried, and it’s so dangerous
to fall into that trap. It’s so dangerous, because I use the fishing
example all the time. The boat goes out into
the middle of the ocean and you have one line in the water and nothing bites that line and one type of bait and then you’re steam home. I’m done. But if you have
15 lines in the water, how much more of a chance do you have to catch something if fire
50 euros target versus two and so when you commit to it mentally, you have to commit and say, no matter what I’m doing 10 of these. I don’t care if it takes
me the entire year. After that 10, if it’s terrible, it didn’t work at all,
I’ll hang up the booths, but I’m gonna do the 10, because it’s the third, the fourth, or the fifth, or the sixth. That’s number one. Number two, the art show
playbook that I have will absolutely make the difference between going and getting the
ROI out of a show and not. We’re a digital first outfit, and what we’re recommending
here is the offline version, but when you bolt the
digital aspect on to it which is running the fish. I’m not gonna go through
the whole playbook but it’s running the fish bowl.
It’s gathering the emails. Having the print giveaway. Following up with the discount and following up again, contacting them individually
to add to carts. The podcast spells the
whole thing out in detail. The ROI, you can get out of running a sale at a show with that versus not, is night and day. You will many times run that and by doing the marketing after the fact you’re gonna get an ROI out of the show that you did not have when the show ended that particular day. So those are the two
things that I would say. – Thank you. Nick so what I’m hearing is, farmer’s market, local
art fairs, art shows, art walks, anything that I
can get myself out there. Maybe even charities. Whatever. They let me do fundraising. – Take a look at the, we have a list that we’re
gonna publish after, of all the different ways, of things you can try and do but go try a show. I said L.A. to San Diego. I want you to like if it works then you can think about that being your opportunity but right now, you just need
to do one. Just go do one. You’re a busy guy. Like you mentioned that. You’re a busy guy, and what you need to do is
just try one on Saturday. This Saturday. I want you to find one this Saturday. That goes for everybody
listening whose in this spot. This Saturday, there is a farmer’s market, a brewery, a something. I’m gonna go to one this
weekend with my family and I’m gonna see, and it’s like if I don’t start seeing artists and
photographers at these things, I’m gonna start going crazy, because we’ve done a couple of calls with some other Art Storefronts members who are actually here, and these are the easiest
things that you can do but you can do one this
weekend for the first time. Just go. Just get a couple of prints, and follow the playbook, and don’t over think it. Don’t try to be perfect. Just go do one, and see what happens. – Next question. We’re L.A. ads. I know you had your hand up. – My name’s Dan. I’m using my business account for Zoom. – It’s all good, L.A. Ads, whatever. – First of all, thanks for doing this. This is fantastic, and everything you guys are talking about is actionable, which is huge. I have a peculiar circumstance that I’m sure others have as well and that is, I do half my work, sort of the lovely landscapes, and places that kind of thing, but the other half of my work is nudes. I do fine art nudes. That’s something I can’t bring to the street festivals. As far as I know, and I’ve been hesitant to do so. So my question is, what do you guys suggest when someone’s marketing
fine art nude photography? Any thoughts on that. That’s actually been a question since I started with you guys about three or four months ago. – Great question. I would imagine. Are you muted Nick? You going? – I’m here. Yeah, I mean the first just like hot take out of my head is like, you’ve got a, that’s a niche and I’m expecting that people who buy nude art are gonna hang it on the wall at their home is a certain type of people that probably congregates somewhere online or in some groups, or appreciate that or collect it. I would think that that is the case right off the bat. – I guess is the question. I’ve not done this before to market it. – Yeah, and I’m pretty confident there is not a playbook out there for that particular, and I can tell you that right now. So here’s what I would say, and it’s interesting, right, because it really just
comes down to creativity. I had a good friend of mine. I’m not embarrassed to say this. I’ll say this. He found an all natural viagra and he tried to start selling the all natural viagra. He’s selling like $200,000 a month of this stuff at this point. He’s killing it so hard. He had to get extremely creative. Every single solitary
place he tried to advertise they got shut down. Facebook shut him down. Google shut him down. He ended up finding a
website called The Chive and The Chive is this website that shares scantily clad women photos, and the what it is it doesn’t matter. It’s you have to think outside of the box is the big question and I would, everything’s on the list. The sex toys, slash porn conventions. At strip clubs. At those types of stores that sell those types of things. Anything. It’s literally just taking the shot. The bad news is that
you’re gonna have a list of some crazy stuff there. The good news is, there’s gonna be no
competition whatsoever. I mean in a lot of places. A lot of places you could
probably walk right in the door and say look, here’s my art. What do you think? You have this kind of
stuff in your store anyway. Let me hang 10 pieces for a month. Hang them for free. If I sell anything, we’ll 50/50 split and see what happens. Like something as simple as that. One quick conversation. Anyone’s gonna be like absolutely. I’ve got a shot. Are you kidding me? I’ve got nothing on my wall
except this weird stuff. I would take it. So I think you gotta
just come up with a list and walk in and let me tell you, if that works, that could be a goldmine. There could probably be a sex toy shop in every single solitary neighborhood in the United States. – Hey, this is a family show.
This is a family show, Pat. – I know, but I’m just
thinking outside of the box. – Honestly, my work tends to be, hopefully tasteful, and that’s the balance. I’m trying to avoid the porn angle, but what you’re suggesting
is actually very sensible at least to start opening
up my thinking about this. – Yeah, and it’s not a judgment call on how you do your things. It’s like unfortunately
there’s a line in the sand. Like you are not gonna be able to do any of the traditional stuff. I don’t care how tasteful
it is. You’re just not. So you’re in the box so that’s okay. That’s an interesting spot to be in. – Yeah, because and also have
you sold this stuff before? Like a decent amount? – Oddly enough, I sold
my first three pieces on Art Storefronts and they were nudes and it shocked me, but it turns out that it
was a specialized case. I’ve not been able to replicate it. Large storefronts no less. – So you did contact those
people and talk to them? – Yeah, I have. – Okay, because that was my suggestion. This goes for everybody. Everybody can learn from this, and when you make it, it’s the same thing as
when you’re in person, if you get a sale on your website, you want to reach out to these people and find out who they are, what they do. So I would say like the more
that you’re able to get sales, learn about these people. Hey, where do you? Why are you into this? If you find some people
that are really into it, it’s like hey, where do you
normally look for this stuff? What groups are you in on Facebook? Where do you hang out with people? Do you get what I’m saying? You can ask some questions to find out where these people are
congregating online or offline, and that will lead you to more people that are like those people which are likely to buy your art. – It’s outside of the box, and the Instagram influencers is probably a good one there too. Okay, Jenny you’re next. Jenny, let me unmute you. – [Jenny] Yeah. I guess I need to unmute myself. – No, no, you’re good. We can hear you. – [Jenny] I have sort of a
slightly different problem. I’m an artist and I’ve gotten
into photography a lot. My site has two different things on it. Photography and artwork, and to complicate it further, I’m also a writer, and I’ve published a couple books. So it’s like I don’t want to feel like I’m constantly hounding people to buy stuff online. I’m just done with that. Maybe the shows are a good idea for me because I could have all of it, but it just seems to me that people try to put you in a box, and say, oh she’s a writer, or she’s a photographer, and she’s an artist. They
can’t deal with all of it. Like who the hell are you? It’s a focusing problem. I’m not sure where to go with that. – So where are you making sales? Tell me what you’re selling. – [Jenny] Well I started
out selling some artwork just to people that I know a little bit. – What about? Let me ask a question
a little differently. Sorry. In the last year or two, break down your sales for me. Like is it 50% prints, or the paintings? How does it break down with the art? – [Jenny] No photos. I haven’t even shown my photos anywhere, and I haven’t really
been pushing the photos, but that’s sort of where
my heart is right now. – You have not sold any photos, and in the last year, how much revenue did you do from your art? – [Jenny] Not much, but part
of it is because I moved in the middle of all of that. – That’s okay, but give me a rough idea. How much? – [Jenny] Not much. Like three or four. – Three or four prints? – [Jenny] Yeah. – Where did you sell those? – [Jenny] Through Art Storefronts. – Oh, you did. Through your website, and then how much your book do you sell? – [Jenny] Well, I haven’t
been pushing any of it. I sell more books. Some of them are in bookstores. – It sounds to me like you’re
spreading yourself pretty thin when you’re just starting
out on everything. – [Jenny] I know. I know. – Look you’re talking to somebody who has made all of these mistakes. I have made all of these mistakes. I gotta tell you. When you have a business, this is a good point. This is a really good point. When you have a business, there really are a lot of
things that you can do. There are. Let me just tell you, there are 15 things that we could add at Art Storefronts right now that we don’t do right now that some of you might be going, why don’t they do that? Why don’t they do that? And a lot of people are. I have learned my lesson so many times and you have to focus on something in order to get good at something. You can’t spread yourself thin. It just doesn’t work. It’s the whole boil the ocean problem, and so even though you can do something doesn’t mean you should do it. Now you might do it later. It’s all about timing. You might do it later, when you’re more successful
in a certain area but the normal way that you want to go is you want to put some lines in the water. You want to get some traction somewhere. In other words, get some sales with some sort of product or
subject matter that you have and look at that as the
wedge that you’re going in it and that’s your beach head. That’s your Normandy. The U.S. Army didn’t go and just try to invade all of the Europe. They went to Normandy
and they took the beach and then they spread out from there. You want to do the exact
same thing. You gotta try to. I can’t answer your question. All I can tell you is, well you sold four prints on your website. There’s plenty of people
here that haven’t sold any. We were just talking to one of them. A couple people back, and so try to focus on that, and push that as far as you can. I have no problem with you putting a line in the water for the photographs or any of the other stuff. Maybe they might take off a little more but ultimately, you gotta try to, you gotta try to take one of these things and move it forward as far as you can. – [Jenny] Yeah, well I
having a solo art show in about two weeks at an art
association in New England. That should tell me something
and it’s all paintings. No photos. – That’s good. – The default answer to this question is it’s really a question of niche selection. Like what’s my niche? Is it photography? Is it literature? Is it paintings? You can have an individual
niche and a brand and be known as the landscape photographer that shoots lighthouses or you can be the artist that
paints bridge reflections. Whatever it is. It doesn’t matter. Or you
can be the brand yourself and you might just go
that route if you want to. You can be Jenny. If I’m pronouncing that correctly. That can be the brand, and you can grow the list
and build yourself up and share what you’re doing and get a loyal following and you could sell enough across the board doing what you like. That’s an option. There’s no right answer ever. – [Jenny] I like that. – Yeah, it’s an opportunity and knowing that allows
you to focus on that and then you’re really just building up. At the end of the day
it’s always the same. If you have a good
niche that works, great. If you don’t you are the brand yourself, that’s okay too. It’s always gonna require marketing. It’s all gonna require
growing your email list. It’s all gonna require
emailing the email list and it’s all gonna require staying on for three to five years, until you have something of serious value. Those are just the rules and there’s no shortcut. There’s no magic way around it. There’s no passive income. You’re not gonna pay a local SEO company and all of a sudden you’re
gonna get 25 orders a month. It just doesn’t work that way. It’s like anything else. It’s just a grind. It’s the way it is. Every company is that way. Every startup. It’s the way it is. I hope that helps. Let
us know how it goes. – [Jenny] I will. Thank you. – Yeah, we want an update on that. Okay, Kimberly you’re next. I’m gonna unmute you right now. – Hi. I have a question, a dynamic I noticed, from people who have bought my work. They meet me and then a long time goes by and then a holiday comes
up and they contact me, and they kind of want
fussed over a little bit and then they buy it through the website. So I was trying to figure out how I could maybe take
advantage of that dynamic, like maybe possibly offering to mark my work as artwork
and so I was thinking maybe offering to speak somewhere, or talking to Italian cultural centers or things like that. I wanted to take advantage. I finally sold enough
to notice the dynamic, but now I don’t know what to do with it. – Kimberly, tell me again, because I didn’t catch what you. They’re calling you, and what did you say there? They’re ask. Are they asking you
questions about the area that you’re painting? – Yes. – What are they asking you? What’s going on there? – A lot of the time they say that they’ve been to the place in Italy, that they are interested in the piece, or a lot of them have a relative. Like maybe a husband or
a parent or something from that location, and almost everybody. Well everybody’s either been to Italy or has a relative from Italy, and also they’ve met me, and they weren’t people I knew before. It’s just I was out and about or traveling and chatting to people when I give them my business card, and then you know, you’re right, they don’t
do anything right then, but a certain amount of time goes by and because they have my business card, they text me or something, and they want fussed over a little bit. I noticed they already
know what they want. They want that piece
because they were there or something, but then once I talk to them, they’re like okay, I’m gonna buy it, but I don’t know how to
put myself in situations to increase that dynamic. – Well I mean, I have a couple. I have a couple of thoughts. I’m not sure if this
is what you’re asking, but it’s first of all, there’s a deep connection happening there. That you’re creating which is awesome, and I’ve seen your work. I know who you are. You’ve been an awesome member, so it’s good to see you, and I’ve been to the Cinque Terre before. Your work is awesome, and you have a total great niche. Like I can totally see
why people connect with it and if they’ve been there and all sorts of stuff like that. Are you? What I’m wondering is are you doing everything you can to get the sale on the spot at the shows or wherever you’re meeting them in person, because I think what you’re saying is there’s a delay that
happens, which is normal. The delay’s gonna be normal, oftentimes, and then once this delay
is over, they contact you. They kind of cause a fuss, and then you kind of bring
them across the finish line. Is that right? – Yes, yes. – Is there any follow up
marketing going on there? Are you emailing them on a regular basis? – Well a lot of the time I meet people when I’m traveling and I
strike up conversations and give them my business card, because oftentimes I speak Italian and I know a lot about the culture because my family’s from Italy and I see people looking lost and trying to figure out what to do and I go over and help them and they’re like oh, hi, and I’m like I’m here traveling too but I’m an artist and I give them my business card and it’s worked really well but I’m not there all the time and so I was trying to think of what I can do to get in contact with people who travel there. I have been getting more traction
in Facebook, in Instagram. I always target my ads to
people who travel to Italy but everything you’re saying is true that I’ve been experiencing really the people who met me at the start are the ones who are turning
into customers quickly because they, I almost feel like it’s further down the
funnel because they met me. – Right, it absolutely is. – If I get this back, let’s put this into business terms. Like when you’re meeting these people you’re meeting qualified leads and you’re moving them
down the funnel for sure. Like somebody who has
seen you and met you. Like that’s one of the other parts that you have to appreciate when you do things in person. Like if we’re talking about art shows or things like that. When they get to meet you,
see your product in person, you’re literally moving them so much further down the
funnel, so much faster, but what you’re asking here is you need to get more qualified leads. You want to expand and
you’re trying to figure out how to do that here, because you’ve kind of
been doing it there. – Yes, yes. – Pat, how would you approach, and how has your Facebook traction been with the Facebook ads? Have you been generating
qualified leads from that and what I mean by that is are they opting in to your lead capture with a 20% off? – I’m getting about a 3% to
4% depending on the month. – Okay, that’s not bad. If you tighten up the
targeting a little bit on that, maybe with the age range
or some other things you’ll probably get that over 5% but you’re close. Pat, what would you say? – Off the top of my head, I would get a big stack of business cards. I would start traveling around Italy and attempting to have 50
to 150 conversations a day. I’d help people that are lost. If that’s working triple down on it. You’re in a good spot, because the niche
selection is such a big one and obviously one that goes to Italy wants a piece of that memory
on their wall forever. My best friends go to Bosetown every year and half their house is
full with pictures now. In the little dishes and
the little everything. It’s a great niche to be in and it’s probably pretty easy to target digitally, being that you’re selling so well already. Being that you already have traction, you’re probably an anomaly in the sense that you’ve got validation. You know your stuff works. It seems like your personality is a big part of the sale. So I would continue mixing
that in as much as possible at all the social stuff. I have to look at your Facebook and look at your Instagram and see if you’re just
showing images of your work or if there’s pictures of
your beautiful smiling face and you’re talking, and occasionally you’re
talking in Italian. You’re saying and all the rest. I think your personality seems to me like a big part of it
based on what I’m hearing, but I also do thing with some
creative work on Facebook you could probably get away with that where most can’t right out of the gates. – Thank you both for your advice. You all are inspiring me to do more videos because that’s the only
thing I can think of besides meeting people in person. – Are you? I think this is a really important point for you especially. Like definitely, definitely, definitely, follow the art marketing calendar. Like because do the giveaways. Keep doing them, because. – I love it. – Do more of them. Give some bigger things. Just get creative with it, but follow all of that, because I think that with your
niche if you just keep going you’re gonna come across people. It’s just like me. I’ve been there. I love the place too, and so as soon as I saw you art, I was like wow, I wonder if
I should get one of those because that was, if you’ve been there, it’s a pretty cool experience. I think those contests and everything that’s in
the art marketing calendar is gonna help you amplify everything and then continue to look for. I think you have some good ideas with maybe there’s some cultural. I don’t really know about that but you’re thinking the right way is what I want you to know. You’re thinking the right way about it which is, get more qualified leads. Where are you going to get them? Facebook is definitely a possibility. I would see what you could
continue to do there. – Okay, thank you so
much for taking the time. – You’re welcome. – You’re welcome. Bruner, you’re next. You’re unmuted right now. Bruner, you still there? Okay, I think. Next is user. I don’t know who user is, but you’re unmuted user. Are you there? – [Joy] I don’t know if, this is Joy. I don’t know why I came in as user. I put my name in. – All good, Joy. We got you. How you doing? – [Joy] Hi, how are you? I’m new to Art Storefronts. I’ve been with Art Storefronts now. I went live in February. – Welcome. – [Joy] One sale, and the majority of what I’ve been doing has been at galleries and shows. This is the first time
I’m taking it online. So I really don’t have an
email list to go through. Basically I’m just starting
from scratch on Facebook. I do have a large Instagram following. Not large, 1,000 people whatever. I’m targeting that as well, and posting four or five times
a day on Facebook as well, but I have an art show. I’m out in Orange county too. I’m actually in a gallery in Laguna, and for the art walk which is Thursday, I’ll be showcasing my art, and where is, there’s a link somewhere on. I guess on the Facebook Wins group that talks about what to do during shows. I’ve been in sales my whole
life selling technology so I’ve been to hundreds of trade shows. I kind of get the gist
of what I need to do and I’ve been out there selling, in either art venues or galleries but I just want to make sure
that I’m not missing anything. – You’re definitely missing something. This is a little bit more advanced than the trade show playbook. We’ll email it to you. Everyone’s gonna get it. Probably a couple hours after this thing. – It’s also, if you go to
the Marketing Resource Vault which is when you’re
in the Art Storefronts site manager it’s in the top bar. You’ll see the marketing resources and then marketing resource vault and then you go there and you search, or actually it’s even on the homepage. Like you’ll see art show playbook and it has everything there. – [Joy] Okay, all right, because I’ve done that giveaway already and I was gonna do a giveaway at the show. To be able to do a fish bowl with either pieces of
paper or business cards, and then also do the giveaway but other than that and I don’t obviously want you to go through the
video that I’m gonna look at. What else do you think is a key component that the majority of
people miss at these shows? – I think that’s it. It’s hand to hand combat there. You’ve got so many people
that are coming by, so as long as you follow the
rules. You have the fish bowl. You have some big balloons hanging on the front of the booth. Win this print. You’re encouraging as many people to drop the cards into
the bowl as possible. You have the automation. The email automation
built up automatically. You announce the winner. Congratulations so and so. I’m so sorry the rest of you didn’t win. I don’t ever win anything either, but let me just do something for you. I’m gonna give you a one time coupon for 25% off anything storewide. It’s gonna expire on Sunday. Here it is. – [Joy] You think I
should have some coupons printed out and ready to go? – No, no, no. We have the whole playbook. – The playbook will show you everything. – Everything you need to do. It’s the followup after the fact that changed the entire game. – There’s a couple of
things I want to mention. Number one, so you’ve been in sales, you’ve done trade shows. I want to make sure that
anybody else listening doesn’t make this mistake. So I was like, and Kimberly, this is for you too. I didn’t get to talk about this, but when you are doing shows you definitely do not
want to print out a coupon and you don’t want to be handing out your business cards. Of course, you have to sometimes. They will ask for one. You want their contact information guys. That is the key. You gotta capture that lead. Capture that lead, and so you don’t want to
do things at trade shows, and I’ve done a ton of
trade shows in my life. So I’ve had to work through this a lot with a lot of people that work for me, but you don’t want to be pushing people out of your booth, and so if you give them a business card. Of yeah, yeah, I’ll go to the
website later and I’ll buy. No, no, no, no, no. You do not want to do that. You want to give them a
reason to buy on the spot. Hey yes, you can buy from me later, but if you buy here today, I can give you a 20% off for the people that are here at the show for coming to the show
and seeing me in person, I’m going to give you a deal. You want to try to get
that sale on the spot because the statistics show that the likelihood of them buying after the fact is way lower, and that’s why you have to do all the followup marketing. That’s why it’s so key, if anybody’s in your booth and you can get their email address you gotta get their email address. You want to get as many as you can. – [Joy] I had that up there mentioning that whoever buys at this particular event will get 20% off? Should I make a little thing? – Well you might just
have your normal prices and maybe slash them, or you might just, yeah, you might have a sign that says, 20% off for all such
and such show attendees. There’s a reason to buy, and then when somebody’s about to leave and they’re like oh I’ll
go to your website later. You’re like hey, I just want you to know, it’s 20% off if you want
to get it here today. I mean it’s a great deal, and so you’re trying
to get it on the spot, and then the point I was saying where I mentioned Kimberly is, Pat and I actually talked to somebody the other day about this, but they were for years, they were doing art shows, and they were handing. I was handing out my business cards, but nothing ever happened and nobody came back to my site and I said, you were close, but you did the wrong thing. You gotta flip that around. Instead of giving your business card, get their business card. Get their information. It’s okay to give your business card. There’s nothing wrong with doing that buy you gotta collect
leads guys. So if you can. Let’s say you’re sitting next
to somebody on the airplane and they like your stuff, it’s like hey, give me your email address or your business card. I’ll get you on my insider’s list. Like when I’m giving special deals, and special content. You’ll love it. I’m always trying to
give great value there and stuff like that, and if they’re down, they’ll give you their email address or they’ll give you a business card. You just got a lead. As opposed to hey, here, check me out later, and then
you don’t ever see them again, and odds are they’re probably not gonna go and look at your website and do that, but you’re gonna do the work and you’re gonna email them. So Joy, I want to go back to you said that you’ve been doing a lot of galleries, and you’ve had success at some galleries and some shows in the past, but you don’t have an email list, right? – [Joy] Well here’s the problem. If I’m at a conference, and I’m selling technology. I’m getting people’s business cards because I’m in more of
a business environment, but so here I am at the shows. I have a book out, a beautiful portfolio and a pen and everyone’s writing their email and information down. Well at the end of the day, I’m talking to people. I’m selling things. I can’t monitor what they’re writing and at the end of the
day I look at my sheet and I’m horrified, because I can’t even
decipher half the emails. People are not leaving
phone numbers obviously. So it’s an email, and they’re not even legible. – Do you have an iPad, or a tablet of some sort? – [Joy] I do, I do. – We have. There is a feature on Art Storefronts where you create a form page with just the email on it and then there’s a toggle on there that says landing page, and if you click that, it will take over the whole screen and all that will be on there is just email and submit, and you can have some text above it. It’s like sign up for my email list. If you want to do it that way
you can have the iPad there. – [Joy] Right, well in the past obviously I didn’t have Art Storefront so I don’t have any venue to send them to. To sign up, but no, that’s a good idea. Will that information be on the link that you’re gonna be sending me too? – We could include that. Let’s make sure that we include that. Let’s write that down. Somebody write that down on our team whose listening to this. You can also search it
out in the support center. There’s a specific article that’s how to create a
sign up form for art shows. In fact, I’m sure it’s in the playbook. I’m sure it’s in the art show playbook. – [Joy] That you’re
going to send me, right? – Yeah, the human resources, yes. – [Joy] Yeah, because
I couldn’t believe it, that I’m looking, when I started here, I have to generate email, so I did a giveaway. I have about 30 to 40 brand
new people from the internet. I don’t know if it’s the
right audience or not. It appears a lot of photographers are liking my work, so I don’t know if
that’s the right audience but then when I’m going
to do my email campaign through MailChimp I’m horrified that none of the emails are appropriate. So if that could alleviate that, that would be great. – Yeah, I would try that. – We have time. Good luck, and I might even come down there and see. – [Joy] I’m at LagunaArt.com. I’m over by the Las Frisas and the museum. – Got it. I just live in Newport. So I’m close. – You’ll see this in the playbook too, but that’s why the fish bowl is good too because the business
card there’s no writing and it’s fast. If you have a business card, if you have the fish bowl
and the iPad or whatever hopefully people will
drop the business card. It’s faster for them anyway and you definitely get
a perfect email address. – We’ve got one more question from James. James, you’re unmuted. Go for it. James are you still there? James? Looks like that’s it. Does anybody that’s left, and if you’re on video we can see you. Done with the last question? – Seems to be messing with his mic. His microphone. He might be coming on here. James, you want to try? – What happened? Now I can’t unmute him.
– I think you’re good James. Can you talk? No, we see you. Got it. – You can hear me now? – Yes. You’re in a dark
tunnel or something. – I’m in the dark. I wasn’t gonna use video. I’ve heard a lot about the
importance of doing shows today which is great, but just on the digital front, someone just mentioned the other day, they hadn’t really even tried much but they have 1,000
followers on Instagram. A lot of my friends, that aren’t even trying to sell anything, will have like 1,000 followers. Maybe I don’t have enough friends, but when starting out, like I’ve gone from 100
to 200 Instagram followers in the last few months
which is pretty cool, but that’s where I’m at. 200 for that, and my Facebook page, I have like 60 people
following it or likes, and I haven’t done a giveaway yet so I’m about to. I want to do my first giveaway
but if I’m announcing it only to that small number of people, do you recommend waiting? Like you gotta have at least 1,000. – No, go for it. – But the giveaway also, it’s the type, as far as I understand it. I know there’s different
types of giveaways. Some people, I’ve seen giveaways where it’s like you mention a friend, you get an entry into it or whatever. Like that obviously would expand
your following right there but if that’s not what it is, for when I’m following the procedure for their first giveaway, how can I get the basic
1,000 followers on Instagram or on Facebook? How do you just grow that initially? So I’m only going to be putting out this announcement about the giveaway to this very small number? Like how does it grow? – Well you’re gonna be
doing a lot of giveaways. The giveaway is actually designed to grow your list and your following. It’s a tactic. As much as anything else. I mean look, we had a project that we were working on recently
called University Fine Art and we literally, this is
Patrick and I doing this, because we’re doing it from scratch and our marketing team and we started with zero and we did a giveaway with zero. Like literally. What did we do? We launched the Facebook
and the Instagram page the day before, and we did a giveaway, and then we ended up with I don’t know, a couple hundred emails. Couple hundred followers. Likes on the page and things like that. I think we spent like
$150 on ads to do that. – Okay, so you boost the posts. – We did that, but I’m not recommending that you do that. We had a targeted focus on. We were starting from scratch. We’re obviously very experienced with Facebook ads and things like that. So I’m willing to throw some
money on the table and risk it. Doesn’t really matter, but you got something to start with. So the people that are
following you right now and do you have an email list at all? – A very small one, yeah. – That’s the other thing too is that we want to get those
people on to your email list. Like you want to have them on all. It’s called the omni channel strategy. You want them on your email list. You want them following
you on social media, because you gotta make sure that they’re seeing
your stuff all the time but don’t hesitate to do it because this is a way
that you’re gonna get from 200 to 300 to 400. The great part about the giveaways is that they compound. So like you do one, and then now a lot of those people are gonna get on your email list and then you’re gonna
grow your social following and then you do your next one. Now the pie is bigger and so it’s gonna grow
even bigger than that and then you do your next one.
It’s gonna get even bigger. So I would not hesitate to start. Pat, what would you say? – Yeah, I think again, this is where the perspective comes in. The tendency is to get
so hung up and say hey, I’m gonna do this one giveaway, and I’m gonna pay for a print, and that’s gonna be expensive
and I’m gonna run this contest and I don’t know if I’m there yet and those are the normal
thoughts to have early on. You gotta just absolve
yourself of those things. You’re working hard on this business. You’re trying to grow this business. You’re going to spend the amount of money that it takes to invest in that print in hours spent trying to get
extra Facebook fan followers and Instagram followers and this and that. This technique works. It will work. You might fall flat on
your face the first time. I mean, terrible. Like grow your list by only six or seven, but you know what? It’ll still be a win. They’re just gonna be like,
okay, here’s where I went wrong. Here’s what went really well. Here’s something new that I learned and I can go and do it again, and I just don’t know. You’re asking the classic
chicken and the egg question like which one came first and it’s hard. There is no right answer. The answer is you beg,
borrow, cheat, steal, hustle, cold deck your family members,
do whatever you have to do, to get it out there as
much as you can early on and it’s hard in the beginning. It just is. It’s the life of it, but after you get a couple
of them in the books it just starts to grow
and get more momentum and they start sharing them and it’s like oh, I
really want to get one, and then the next thing you know you’ve done six of them, and the next thing you know it’s Q4, and it’s like I never won one of those. I actually do want some of his art. I’m gonna buy a couple of pieces and that’s how it goes. That’s how it goes. – And remember, if you have any friends that are telling you. I’ve got 1,000 followers. Who knows if they’re legitimate or not. You can go to these sites, and Fiverr.com and buy 1,000 followers and some weird things like that. It just doesn’t really matter. All that matters is that
there’s quality people on there that are worth it for you. Yeah, and don’t over
complicate the giveaway, because like I was saying, you can go to the buy a photo paper print that’s a decent size. I think you could probably buy a 24 by 36 for under $30. It’s not a big deal. – You’ll incentives running sometimes too. – Yes, yes, I was just gonna say that. That Chris on our marketing
team, he set this up. He just asked me about it the other day, but there’s a discount going on on the Graphic Dimensions site. It’s ASFprints.com and I think he has it. It’s either in the art
marketing calendar somewhere, but what we’re trying to do
is when we’re telling you guys to run a giveaway and you
gotta buy some prints, we’re trying to give you a discount, to make that cost as low as possible. That’s how badly I want you
guys to do these things, and do these shows as well. Like, get the cheapest price that you can and get out there and find traction. Like that’s the most important thing. So we may have to follow back
up on that, but it’s not like, you don’t need to go
invest $199 on a print to give away $1,000 print. If you’re just starting
out, which you are, then maybe go with the smaller one, and then just start
building it up from there but just dip your toe in. But still do it. – Okay, thank you. – You’re welcome. – I guess that brings another question because I’m in Canada. Has anyone done the math as to whether or not with the
exchange rate and shipping, border costs, customs. Like is the Graphic Dimensions, because I hear all about it now. Graphic Dimensions. How can I figure out whether it’s worth it to switch it from Print Partner? – I think you gotta
stick with Print Partner. There’s just so many complications. – Okay, that’s good to know. That’s all. – But I’ll tell you this, they’ve got great pricing. They’ve got great pricing, like out of the gate, so
I would just make sure you’re looking at the right media type. That’s why I keep saying photo paper. I know the business so well that I know that you can make
amazing prints on photo paper but photo papers are cheap. They’re really cheap for you guys, so you can have a matted photo paper and it’s like somebody’s
getting something. They look really nice, but it cost you, not very much. You know what I mean? So that’s what you can do, and you’ll spend $20, $30. I don’t know what it is. What size you want to pick. The bigger you go the more
expensive it’s gonna be, but you’re gonna pay for that and then you’re gonna
increase your following as much as you can and maybe you’ll get a
sale or two out of it. You might. – For promoting the giveaway, probably it wouldn’t
hurt to boost the post. I’m assuming then. Just a basic. – Yeah, the long and the short is this is exactly why
you have to execute. Everyone’s market is
a little bit different and how it gets traction early is a little bit different and it’s one of those things where I’ve never seen a technique have higher ROI in terms
of pouring some gas on a very very small fire, and so you have to run
it a couple of times. There’s no shortcut to taking
your licks and learning. So you can go at it the first time. You could run it for a couple of days. See what kind of response you’re getting and then hammer the boost. Give it $10, $20, and see how it goes, and just takes notes and
see how it works for you the first time around and don’t hesitate to
reach out to your friends. Seven of them say do me a favor, will ya? I’m trying to get some
of this art out here. Will you just share this with
your email list, somebody, and do some hand to hand combat early on. Prints, family, ask whoever. It’s like the ask isn’t that heavy. It’s like hey, my cousin James, he’s doing a print giveaway. He really wants to grow his following. Can you guys check this out? It’s a free print. His art’s really cool. I think you’ll like it. Pretty easy to convince
somebody to do that with a little arm twist and
buy them a couple of beers, and see what happens. – Yeah, I also think
that when I talk about the leverage, this goes for everybody, the leverage of the cost of the print, just appreciating that, Instagram influencers, moderators of Facebook groups, if you have a specific niche, and you can approach the
moderator of that group and say hey, I’ll give
you a print for free, like will you share my
contest in your group? These guys will do it. You will find people that
will do that for you. If they’re a big enough fan of the content of the subject matter that you have, or they might just do it for a price. Like $50 or $100, but there’s ways to amplify your contest to get in front of other people that are really creative like that and I encourage everybody
to be thinking about it because like I said, the cost
of these prints are so low, it’s just a huge advantage,
for what you price them at. Like hey, this is a $200 print. I’d be happy to give you
one if you’d share this and it’s like he has no
idea that cost you $35. He’s like wow, that’s amazing. I’ll take that. Sure, I’ll share it. Try things like that too. I think people should be
trying that all the time. – Thank you. – You’re welcome. – Pat, Nick, we’re pretty
much out of questions, unless anyone that’s still on video wants to raise their hand. – Nobody else has any questions? – Michael. I think Michael’s raising
his hand like he’s got one, so I got you Michael. Don’t worry. – Come on guys. We’re here for you. – I gotta go down and
find your name. Hold on. Here he is. All right, Michael, you’re up. – [Michael] Hey, I’m so
new I haven’t even gotten loaded up yet through
to my punch list as such and I’m listening to all this good stuff in the playbooks and all
that and it sounds great but one thing you talk about
doing gifts of a print. Now to me, artwork is when
you put it up on the wall. So do I give a print or do I actually give a print that’s framed, and under glass from the printing shop, and also when you have discounts, do you discount the
framing and everything? Is that discounted? – I believe the whole thing is discounted if I’m not mistaken. I could be wrong. – [Michael] I can understand
discounting the print because it’s not that expensive, but when you start framing things up, the price goes up drastically. You see what I’m saying? – Yeah, it’s your choice
of what you want to offer to answer that question and you might want to start with something a little bit more modest, but if not and you want to go for it. I’ve got no problem with that. – [Michael] I want to say if I say there’s a 20% discount. I don’t want people coming back and going hey, that was just on the print. I want the whole package. I want it under glass and on my wall. – I’d say a couple of things. One, if a restaurant entices
you with an appetizer to come in and get the meal, think of it like that. I get your point. I take your point about you think art is ready to hang on the wall but this is also just a marketing tactic and so think of it like an appetizer instead of giving them the
entire meal and dessert and then number two, before you run one of these things, this inevitably happens always. You start creating all these situations that might happens, might not happen. Like well what if this
happens? What if that happens? What if somebody comes back? Do not stress about it, until it happens. Period. Once it happens, and it happens more than twice, you’ve got a problem. Otherwise, no problem. – Don’t worry about it
until the well runs dry. – Exactly. Don’t sweat the small stuff. – You guys would all laugh. You guys would not believe the way that we move over
here at Art Storefronts from a marketing standpoint. I mean we’re running. Like I tell you guys, test, test, test. Like we’re talking about test. How many tests do you think
we’re running a day, Pat? – Oh my gosh. – It’s just ship it, ship it, ship it, like as soon as anybody is
over thinking everything I know. I always use this 80/20 rule. I say it all the time. Everybody’s probably tired of hearing me talk about it at this company, but. – Hey, it’s Italian laws Kimberly. – Pareto’s law. 80% of your sales come
from 20% of your products. 80% of your joy in life comes from 20% of your friends. You can apply it to anything. When it comes to marketing tactics and things like that, you just gotta move quickly and just get 80% of the way there of like whatever you’re trying to get done and ship it and go, because that last 20% it can take you a month. I’ve told people, one of the biggest management things that I try to teach people is that if you take a
project that you want to do and you get it 80% there, you can probably get it done, almost any single project today. Like literally today, but if you go for
perfection on the last 20% it could take you another month, and if you just 80/20 everything, you can ship so much. You can move so fast. In a matter of a month, you can do 40 things, rather than one. You got one perfect thing done and you don’t even know if it’s gonna work or not. – [Michael] I’ve always said,
perfection is for the Gods. Excellence is obtainable. – There you go. – [Michael] Also I was listening about and I don’t know if I was
it on your information because you’ve snowed me
with thousands of things in the last week or so here
of just getting started. – Yeah, we’re good at that. – [Michael] Basically with
the show, go out print. Let’s just I have 1,000 pieces but I’m just starting out and maybe I got 100 pieces up on my board. When I go do a show, I print up 50 of those and put them in the tent and have a couple computers
out front and say, this is a virtual show. You can buy it off the wall, or order it up. Is that what you’re saying, and or get contacts? – No. – [Michael] No. I go out and do a show at the park. I got my pieces. – You just have your
prints there at the booth. You follow the art show playbook. I would just read that. It’s probably confusing
hearing us talk about it since you’re new. I would read the material. It’ll make a lot more sense. – [Michael] That’s what
I thought you were doing is show your work, and you can buy it off the wall here but I’d rather have you
go on to my email list or contact list and buy
it through Art Storefront. – No, no, no, no, no. You want to sell them that piece right then and there if they will buy it. As a secondary, you’re
trying to collect leads. That’s the principle. – [Michael] I saw the thing. What I thought I saw was you’re at a show in Phoenix, and people from Florida are there and go, you know I’d like that and I’d like that but I don’t want to put
it on the plane and such. – Oh, you’re talking
about something different. Okay, yeah. You can take the order on the spot, and the printing company will just drop ship it to their house. But you can take the order. You don’t have to force them to get on a computer or an iPad. – [Michael] Yeah, what I
mean do it on the computer. – Yeah, exactly. Yeah that’s right. That’s right. I’m sorry. Get your website live. Get your website live. Any person that’s on here that does not have their website live, remember Pareto’s principle
applies to the website. You’re not in the game
unless your website is live so please get your website live as fast. – [Michael] Well I just got my thing back on what I didn’t get
quite right for you guys, so tomorrow I’m bringing my tech in and hopefully we’ll complete all of the spots I missed
and we’ll get there. I’m really excited about this guys. I really am. – Glad to have you. Welcome. – [Michael] I just need to know, and I think you’re going to show me, how to get my stuff to the right people. That’s what it’s all about I think. – That’s the game. – All right, thank you for this talk. It’s good. – No problem. We have one last question
that came in on text and it looks like from Stan and he’s just asking about what type of Facebook ads? We didn’t really cover what type of Facebook ads specifically but I do have a recommended course on how to approach Facebook ads and where to get started
with Facebook ads. It’s a podcast that we
recorded just recently so we can include that in the email that we send to everybody. – Yeah, that’s too big of a topic to just go over right here. It’s more important to watch Patrick’s recommendation on that. If anybody’s thinking about, is this just a good point? If anybody is thinking
about starting Facebook ads go there first and watch
that and listen to that. Is that right, Pat? – Yeah, yeah definitely. – Before you start wasting money and spending a bunch of money. He’s gonna guide you
in the right direction of where you should start, because there’s things that
you should advertise at first like to warm traffic before
you try to do anything cold. Most people should never do cold. We won’t go into all of that. He’s covered it. – Great, glad you liked it Melissa, and then anyone else? Any further questions, or do
we leave it there or what? – If nobody has any other questions, if you guys could type in anything here of did you like it? What else would you like to hear about? What else can we do to
make this more valuable? I want to make sure everyone of you. Remember what I said in the presentation. I do not want your business stuck. I do not want anybody’s business stuck. If it’s stuck, that’s
why we have this product. This marketing and business
consulting product. You gotta ask the questions. Let us help you move forward. I don’t want any entrepreneurs business getting stuck here guys. – Okay, got some good comments. – Thanks guys, appreciating
all the comments. Any last minute? Anybody shy out there, or didn’t get a chance to ask anything want to hop in real quick before we go? Travis and Abby. Raise your hand. Raise your hand. Use the raise your hand button on the right hand side of
you want to get on verbally. – Or they can type it in too and while those are coming in. – Bruce. Bruce raised his hand. – Got it. Bruce, you’re on. – [Bruce] Hi. I’m been with Art Storefronts
for about two months. – Welcome aboard. – [Bruce] I’m mainly on Facebook. I sell photography, show photography. I’ve sold maybe eight
or nine or 10 prints, mostly in the paper prints
for $10 or $11 range. Maybe 900 followers. I post most days. I get 200 to 1,200 likes on my photos. I’ve got a lot of shares. I’ve only got about 54 email contacts. I do send out maybe every other week, I’ll send out what you
guys call love letters explaining a photograph and what I did and all that kind of thing, and I don’t get a lot of feedback on it. I’m just not quite sure where I should be going from here. – You’re posting on Facebook. The photos are getting a ton of likes. Are you linking back to
your website occasionally? – [Bruce] On my own Facebook page, I always have my website posted and some pages they
don’t want you to do that but I do post my website quite a bit. – Is there a reason to go? Are you giving them a reason to go there? – [Bruce] Sometimes I do. Sometimes I’ll say
prints from 8X10 to 20X30 available at my website. I’ve done that a few times. – I don’t know if that’s
a good enough reason, but let me ask you this. Have you ran a contest yet? – [Bruce] No, I haven’t done a contest. I haven’t done any giveaways. – That’s the next move. – [Bruce] I’m not quite sure about the mechanics of that yet. – That’s the next move. When we’ve got the whole thing mapped out. I think you’re a prime person to be following the Art Marketing Calendar pretty closely, because. – [Bruce] You get a lot of shares. Sometimes I’ll have 30 shares on a print. I figure why should they buy it if they’re getting all
this stuff for free. – It just works. The giveaway. You gotta get these people
on to your email list. Gotta get them to opt in but then you also want
to expand that audience and since you’re already starting. You’ve got the seeds in there. You’ve got enough there. The giveaway is just gonna amplify that and remember at the end of the giveaway you probably haven’t seen
the whole playbook yet. It’s pretty genius, but at the end of the giveaway, the people who participate in the giveaway get a discount for three days at 20% off or whatever you want to do, and so they get this unique opportunity by participating in the
giveaway to buy something, but under a scarce
timeline, and that works. You can see in the small wins group, people make sales from that all the time. Some people don’t. It depends on what you’re
working with so far and how many qualified people you have in your following at that time but sometimes the people stay on there and then you end up
getting a sale from them at a different holiday down the road, but I think that’s, I would definitely hop right into the Art Marketing Calendar, just right off the bat, because it sounds like, you’ve got something to start with. – [Bruce] Thank you. – The next question is from Barb Gonzalez. Barb, I’m gonna unmute you right now. Go ahead. – [Barb] Hi. – Hi, Barb. – [Barb] Am I supposed
to do anything else here? – No, we can hear you. – [Barb] Okay, great. I’ve been on Art Storefronts
for a couple years. The first year went really really well. Last year was not so good, and now I’m really wanting to revamp it. I’ve got tons of photos
up and everything else, but I feel like when
I would send stuff out to all of my emails and everything I just really never got anywhere and I spent money on Facebook ads and I spent money on giveaways and I just really feel like nothing ever went anywhere, so how can I kind of renew everything and get it revamped and going again? – Let’s deconstruct this. Let’s talk about when things were well. Tell me everything about
when things were well. What were you selling? What was on your site? What I’m gonna do right now is I want to understand exactly
what happened in that year and then what changed in the next year. Let’s talk about this. Let’s talk about your great year. – [Barb] One thing is that
I had a really hot photo that everybody shared. It was from the eclipse. It got shared all over the country so people came to my
site and they bought that or they bought other stuff and I think what’s happening is that the people that bought back then are not repeat customers. So they bought then, and now they’re the ones
who are on my email list that they’re not buying anymore. – How much of your sales in that year were this eclipse? What is your regular subject matter? Is it related to the eclipse
or was that just a random? – [Barb] Kind of random, yeah. – Okay, so in other words, you caught lightning in a
bottle and that was gone but you never really had traction with your other content. I mean have you been making
sales of your other stuff. I just got. I had to do other stuff, so I have to just dedicate myself. So If I have to rededicate myself, what would be the first
thing I should start doing? – Tell me this though. Have you ever sold your other stuff, that’s not the eclipse? – [Barb] Yes. – What type of content is it? – [Barb] It’s landscapes
and wildlife and stuff. Mostly the landscapes sell. – Okay, and where have you sold those? Have you sold them primarily
in person or also online? How is that broken down? – [Barb] Mostly online. – Mostly online, and where online? – [Barb] From the Art Storefronts. – On your website, and I presume were you
following the marketing and doing social posts and
then people would come back and so forth? – [Barb] Actually no, it was more SEO. The one I sold that I didn’t know were people who searched out a subject and came and bought. – Okay, and how many of
those were there roughly? Was it a decent amount of sales? Was it 1,000? – [Barb] Not a lot. I mean probably half dozen, dozen maybe. – Okay, well the good news about that is that you kind of got the seeds of some traction there a little bit. Like you randomly sold some content and it was good enough. Is it all kind of the same
type of subject matter or is it across the board? I mean I know you said landscape but let’s get a little more specific. – [Barb] You have different
kinds of landscapes. I live in the Pacific Northwest so it’s really beautiful up here. I might have everything from waterfalls to forests to mountains, but I also have different places as well like Washington D.C. and New York because I’ve done travel photography, and then I do have a section on wildlife, whether it’s from Africa or birds. I have a lot of birds. I have flowers and I have abstracts. – But what is making sales primarily? The Pacific Northwest stuff or? – [Barb] I wish I could say that but it kind of goes all over the board. – No way. – [Barb] I get people
that really love birds and so suddenly sell a few birds and then my friends I think mostly buy the landscape ones. – I was saying earlier, you must be really good, because this does not happen often. – [Barb] What doesn’t happen? – You’re just making sales with all sorts of different subject matter and it’s coming from random searches and so that’s pretty cool but what I was saying earlier is that normally you
want to spend your time focusing in on one niche or a niche that at least you can really
have an advantage on and own. I was making the example earlier, like if you’re an Austin photographer and you’ve got an advantage, because you live in Austin. Over every other
photographer that doesn’t, and so that’s your advantage. Normally you want to try to find some sort of an advantage that you have. It could be some sort of locality. It might not be. It could be something else, and then really push that, and I think it’s an important point because I’m coming from
my own perspective here and also in advising other people and just that when you start
spreading yourself thin trying to build multiple
different types of audiences and constituencies, it can get really hard, and I prefer to go after one if I can if I really got traction there. Otherwise, you go to what
Pat was saying earlier. He was advising somebody else that you become the
brand and it’s about you. – That’s what it sounds like here. – Yeah, it might be. It might be, but so what’s the next move then? Like the next move to me would be, well have you ever done
anything in person, Barb? – [Barb] Yeah, I’ve done
some represented shows. I haven’t gone to any art
fairs or anything like that. – You could do really well at those because it sounds like
what you have is appealing, but Pat, where would you go? – I would start just by asking a question. The year that was great, not withstanding the hit with the eclipse, did you do more marketing that year than the year you did after the fact or was the marketing
consistent throughout? – [Barb] I did more marketing yeah. – You did more marketing in the good year? So you knew it was that. That always plays a role. It sounds to me like you’ve
got this figured out already, you’re just eased up on the marketing. – [Barb] Yeah, here’s
another question though. Since some of the stuff has
been there for two years, I’m trying to bring in some new stuff so it kind of wakes it up a little bit but on the SEO, should
I redo some of the SEO so it gets seen again, or
refreshing things like that? – We are extremely bearish
on SEO, just in general. I’d have to look at your
stats and see if you’re really getting SEO traffic. A lot of people think marketing has a halo effect and so what happens is you
do something on Facebook or you do something in your email or you do something on Instagram or wherever it may be. People go home, they type your name, because that’s what they remember. They come to your website and they buy and you’re like oh my gosh, this is SEO. This SEO is amazing. It’s just bringing people out of nowhere. No it’s not. You attracted those people and some other than you. They Googled you and they found you. That’s what our data set shows us across the board is nine
times out of 10 what happens. Not show me photos of
waterfalls in Seattle and they found you that way and they bought. That’s not to say that can’t happen. It’s just really low probability which is why we’re so bearish on recommending it in the slightest. We have to look at your stats to kind of get a more
in depth look on that but if you’re selling
well, that hit aside, it sounds to me like you just need to stay consistent
with your marketing. That’s it. – [Barb] I have one other question. The other question is
that I am a columnist for the newspaper here, so I have a following, but it’s not about photography. Is there some way that
I can play off of that? – Absolutely. Absolutely, you can. Where do they follow you? Your column obviously. Your columns obviously, right? – [Barb] Yeah, it’s through the newspaper both online and print, but it’s about food. So it’s not about the things that I take pictures of. – What kind of relationship do we have with the editor here? Our shameless website plugs, is that above board? I would go for it. I would go for it. – [Barb] I can put it
at the end of my email that is related to the website. – Great. Barb Gonzalez world class food commentator can be seen hanging out
on her photography site at barbgonzalez.com. – [Barb] Perfect. Oh, I love it. – Edit the tagline tomorrow and see if they can’t do it retroactively to all of the old posts. – [Barb] Cool. – I’m bribing the web guy. – By the way, did you
utilize that position to catch fire with this eclipse piece because the thing that’s
in the back of my head. – [Barb] No, it’s new. – How did you do that? Because I’m like, can you do that again? Do you have some sort of a recipe that you followed that you got? – [Barb] What I did is
there was the eclipse and I took the photos and it was a composite shot and I said, okay if people
are gonna be excited about it I gotta get it out within
24 hours of the eclipse. So I got it on to Facebook
within 12 or 24 hours. I created the photo and everything else and got it out there, and it just got shared. It got shared so much that I still meet people across the county who said oh my God,
I’ve seen that picture. That was what it was and it just got a lot of people. – Serendipity. Unfortunately, those eclipses they don’t happen every weekend. We’ll have to be more
creative to duplicate that. – [Barb] But that’s pretty
much how it happened. – That’s interesting. It still is interesting, it’s hard to repeat, and I don’t mean that an eclipse. I’m just thinking about what other events, like a volcano erupting, and take a picture of it but
there’s no volcanoes there. I’m thinking of anything but if that concept of very quickly take the picture, get it up. – Newstracking. Newstracking it’s called. – Exactly, exactly. If other people aren’t doing that, again, it really surprises
me, I have to say, and you guys saw this in my presentation but it always surprised me. You guys are probably all sitting here that are on this and listening to this and are going gosh, the
market is so crowded, and I honestly completely
disagree with that. I completely and utterly believe and disagree with that. Absolutely, absolutely, because if there is
anything that I’ve learned in business, like when
you’re in a market like this, I’ll tell you this. Everybody, like 99% of the market, is on Fine Art America, is trying to do SEO, and is doing all the easy things that you don’t have to work for. That’s what everybody does
in every single market. They don’t do anything past that. It’s like they go this far. You guys all know it. Internally, nobody wants to do the work. We all don’t want to do the work. That’s just who we are as human beings and the truth of the matter is 99%, 99.9% of the people out there are not willing to do the work, so they’re gonna do all the easy things. So just think about that. What are the easy things that you can just sit back in your room. You can take some photos from your iPhone and you can upload them to everything, everyone of these sites. Every single one of them and anybody in the world can do it and they’re not discriminating at all who can do it and who can’t, and obviously, those are
the worst channels to be in. You have maximum competition which only means that prices go down. If you go to Fine Art America and you look at anything pretty much you’re gonna have a ton of content to choose from there. Like just a ton, and you have no way of saying wait, my work’s got value here, and so it’s just ultimately just a race to the bottom and I hate that, and so what you want to
do as an entrepreneur, because you guys are all entrepreneurs. You’re running startup companies, is you always want to
run where people aren’t. You always want to be
where nobody else is. – [Barb] Where’s that? – That’s where the advantage is. That’s where the arbitrage is and that’s exactly what
we’re teaching you guys. That’s what Pat and I are bearish on SEO is because I built a business on SEO from 2003 to 2008 and
it’s like this thing, this is a tactic. What’s the saying, Pat? Marketers ruin everything eventually. Ruin everything eventually, and so these tactics
they don’t work anymore and what I love to say too is as soon as any discipline, when there’s courses being taught to the public all over the
country, which there are. You can go to an SEO course downtown. When those things are happening, anything that’s been institutionalized and spread like that, it’s done. It’s over. It’s already over. Don’t fall for it. We’re trying to help you guys where the arbitrage actually is and that’s why it may seem like we’re pushing Facebook
and Instagram a lot. Obviously we’re pushing
in person just as much. That’s a big topic here today, but there is an arbitrage
on Facebook and Instagram. There still is. Eventually there will not be. Eventually there will not be. As sure as the son rises tomorrow, that will change, but rest assured we will be moving to wherever the next things are and we will be staying on top of it. Does that make sense? – Very good. Travis has raised his hand. I’m going to pivot to Travis. Travis, you’re on. – [Travis] WHat’s up fellows? How are you? – Hey, Travis. We’re running some sort of radio show like hey, Pat. Hey Travis from Buffalo. Travis, you’re on. – [Travis[ It’s Travis
from Brooklyn, not buffalo. – You’re on. – [Travis] I’m sitting
here trying to formulate how I’m gonna ask my questions but I’m just gonna go ahead and rake myself over the coals. – Fire it off. – Good man. That’s how we roll. – [Travis] I’ve been on Art Storefronts for about a year. I have six pieces on my shop. I post to Instagram on a relatively regular basis and just a little bit of background, I work as a full time graphic designer, slash illustrator during the day. Mainly working in the fashion industry, and I typically do my painting work and fine art, quote unquote
fine art work at night. Another part of the equation is that I am a full time single father to two young boys, so my time to get all of these things done is extremely limited. That being said. – You and I were talking to the bot right? – [Travis] What’s that? – You and I were talking to
the messenger bot, right? – [Travis] Yes, yes. First things first, hearing you guys talk
about doing live shows is something that
incredibly appeals to me. I’m pretty good talking to people. It would actually present an opportunity for me to paint live which I think is a great draw. With that being said, because of the situation that I’m in, with my children and what not, I don’t have a support group around me. I’m solo 100% of the time. The show thing is off the
table as of right now. That being said, I only have
probably 1,500 followers on Instagram. I don’t really work
with Facebook that hard so probably a few hundred
followers on Facebook but obviously when I
do post on my Instagram it goes right to my Facebook. My Instagram stories go
right to my Facebook. I actually even started a Tik Tok and I don’t know if
anybody’s up on Tik Tok but I started posting
art on there as well. That all being said, I’m at a complete standstill and I guess my main question is, I feel like because I only have five or six pieces on my store, I can continue to put
that stuff out there. Repost and repost and repost on Instagram trying to get people to come to my shop but it’s all extremely repetitive and if I only have 1,500 followers, they’re all kind of seeing the same stuff over and over again. – For sure. Why do you have the six pieces, because that was the first question I had. – [Travis] I think those
six particular pieces are, it’s basically mainly portraiture. There was one hyper realistic still life and I actually do a bunch of calligraphy slash calligraphy type of work. – Do you have other content? – [Travis] I’m sorry? – Do you have other content? – [Travis] I do, yeah, yeah. – Are you creating any
new content right now? – [Travis] Because I spend my days clicking a mouse on a computer, my generating new work tends to take quite along time for me and it’s not that I can’t. I just don’t have the ability to bang a piece out in a day or two. Typically I’m widdling away on a painting for a month or two months. – That’s actually awesome, but I don’t know if you saw, there was a post in the
group a couple days ago, where somebody, one of our painters, was just doing progress photos, and maybe some videos, and then they sold the piece, before it was even done, or right when it was done. – [Travis] That’s amazing. Yeah. – Yeah, but you should do that. Even though you’re just slowly chipping away at your new piece, like that’s different content than those six pieces, and then you could also
post the other ones and be like hey, this is like, you’re reviving an old one, or just announce it as a new one. It doesn’t matter. – I’ll give it to you. Your stuff is really cool but I definitely think you
need to expand the line. Six pieces is not enough and especially not changing at all in that year’s time. If you can do an expanded series of that same style that you have, I think it would do really well. I really enjoyed it, and
I look at a lot of art, but I think it’s very good. I’m not kidding. – [Travis] I appreciate it. Thank you. – What are your sales like? Overall? – [Travis] I think my first year I only sold four or five pieces. One and mainly I don’t know
if you can see on my site I did a piece for a show, which actually took a good scan of to make prints of, of a dog fully tattooed
in Japanese body suit but on a dog, and people love that piece, and I sold a bunch of prints of that, but actually the prints that I thought were going to do well, which are my hyper-realistic
oil paintings, I haven’t sold one. It’s funny how it worked out that way where I did a very realistic pen drawing, which took me a very long time to do but the painting that I
widdled away three months on didn’t move, so it’s just, and ironically as far as my calligraphy, Calligraffiti type of stuff, I usually make time
lapses of all those pieces because they’re actually fun to watch. It’s fun. People enjoy seeing
the thing come to life. I do time lapses. I post on my Facebook and Instagram and I actually sold. I got some commissions and I sold some originals. That being said, I only have one of those pieces on my shop. – Everything else, and I would focus 100% on that. That sounds successful. – [Travis] That was literally, that was my next question. Do I, because of something I love so much, do I pivot down that lane and just rock with that, as opposed to doing hyper
realistic oil paintings that take months to do. – I’ll stop you right there. Yes. – Do more Facebook Lives. More Instagram Lives, and start doing those
things that are selling because obviously that’s working. If that’s working, don’t overthink it. That market’s telling
you Travis, this works. Do more. Travis, this works. Do more. Do more of it. Literally, right now. Next one, and you gotta get more stuff in your shop any which way you slice
it. You gotta do that. – [Travis] Hearing it from you guys, and that’s what I needed to hear because I’ve mulling this over in my head for weeks and months. – Stop mulling. Travis, this works. Do more. – Follow the Art Marketing Calendar too. – [Travis] And that was my next thing. I hear you guys talking
about doing giveaways and stuff like that. I haven’t done that yet, but after hearing everybody talk about it, and all your feedback to everybody else, that’s the next thing on my list. – You hear me saying it because guys, who do you think created the Art Marketing Calendar? Patrick and I did, and our marketing team but we created it. It’s not there for to just ignore. It is there. We’re trying to make it easier and easier to execute on as you guys know. We love to know where
you guys get confused or what’s wasting time, so that we can build templates and do anything we can to save you guys more time, especially for people in your spot Travis where you’re a dad, and you’ve got the whole load on yourself. We’re trying to make it
as simple as possible but we want everybody doing it because we know that it works. It works if you have traction. There are people that have said to us, hey, I’ve done everything
that you’ve said on there but nothing was working, and it’s like they just didn’t have traction in the first place and so you gotta get traction first and some people actually start up and their friends and family is all the traction they need and it just kind of amplifies from there but for a lot of other people it doesn’t work that way. The friends and family are not people that buy art. They’re not qualified leads. So they have zero qualified leads. They’re going to make zero sales. – [Travis] One more quick question. If I am committing down the lane of doing what people
have been responding to which is the calligraphy types of work but I still have that
figurative portraiture oil painting on my page, so then I really shouldn’t
be pushing that stuff. I should really be learning more into the calligraphy type of stuff and almost not ignore the other stuff but I mean it doesn’t even
really make sense to push that because people just haven’t
been responding to it. – Exactly. That other stuff is your hobby. Your business is doing what
the market is telling you. – Listen to the market. The market doesn’t lie. – [Travis] Do I? That stuff that’s up there that’s not really, it hasn’t
moved literally at all. – Pull it down. – [Travis] Take that down? – I would pull it down, but don’t pull it down until you get some of this other stuff up. I can’t have you go
from six pieces to two. That’s not gonna work. – Remember look at Meg Napenberger. She has bison and all sorts of. – Non interrelated stuff. The reality is that once
you build your brand up big enough you can start selling that other stuff again, but it’s just not where you
want to focus in the short term. – Just prioritize it Travis. Just make sure that it’s like
the top content that they see. Don’t let it get in the way of the stuff that’s actually selling. – Got it. – Don’t over think it too much. That’s not a big deal. I always try to tell this to people. Just get more qualified leads. Get more people into your funnel. Have the right. Focus on the right content. Promote the right content, and you’re gonna be good to go. The rest will take care of itself. – [Travis] Thank you very much. I appreciate it. – No problem. All right,
I think that’s it. I don’t know if we have
any other questions. Larry, I see you. Larry went for the old
fashioned hand wave. I caught it. I got ya. I got ya. All right, you’re unmuted. Go ahead, Larry. – Hi, can you hear me? – Yeah, we sure can. – Okay, sweet. Thanks. I use an old fashioned way because I couldn’t find the
button that said hand wave. Maybe my computer’s more
old school than I am and that’s saying a lot. I’ve been with you guys for I don’t know, three or four years, and yeah, being an artist it was like a hair pulling
thing to get the site up and thank God I had a wife who isn’t as stressed out
about that stuff as I am but by and large I really love the site. My stuff looks good on it. My art career has been a
late blooming thing for me career wise, and so I’m
having some success. I’m here in Austin. I’m having some success. I’ve got a one man show at
a gallery in East Austin. I’ve invited you guys. I sent that to Emily. Maybe you all. Would love to see you. But I have, and by the way, I am not availed. I’m probably the first to admit I have not availed myself of, once having gotten the thing set up and posting events and
what have you on the site really not availed myself
of any of the horsepower that you guys. – Boo, boo. – I’d like to say yeah, I’ve been busy slaving away in the studio and just haven’t had time but that would be not
totally true as well. I have one piece. A large five by, four by five foot painting
last year that I did and I’m gonna show it to you right here. This is actually just a print. I don’t know if you guys can see that, but this is a print obviously. This piece was called Ballhalla. It was a surrealistic
version of my interpretation of what my dog’s afterlife was like. There’s a waterfall and there’s giant tennis ball shaped orb that represents that. Anyways, the original sold last year and I was very thankful for that. – What’d you sell the
original for out of curiosity? – It was listed at $6,000 and I had just for a Christmas special I had knocked 20% off and someone who had been following me saw the 20% off and
came in and snagged it. – Love it. So you have been using
some of the marketing then. – Well, I have. Yeah, I’d love to be
making a whole lot more but anyways, here’s the deal. When I first did this painting, my cousin is a member
of a dog Facebook group and he posted it and over a
weekend it got 30,000 likes, and all these people clamoring over it, and of course, because
it was on dogspotting.com they really frowned on him saying, yeah, and if you really like this you can go to my cousin Larry
Jolly’s website and buy it. Although he did do that a little bit before he got his hand slapped. Because it was so popular and we fostered Golden Retrievers and we’re all into that community as well and I sold a few prints of this piece. In fact, it’s been the
majority of the prints that I’ve sold through Art Storefront I’m wondering if there’s any way that you guys can help me figure out a way to really leverage this. I mean I really resonated with the story of the woman who lucked into the. – Eclipse. – The eclipse thing, and I’m like this is my eclipse. This is my 15 minutes, and I’d like to extend
that 15 minutes if I could by selling prints and mousepads. I mean I’ve got a little pop up thing at the Arboretum right now, that has some of those items but man, wouldn’t it be nice if some of those 30,000 likes, and we got Reddit hits, and there was like, I’m an old dude. I don’t do social media that much but I understand that I had
like 40 or 50,000 likes, and I did get a lot of sales from people in Seattle
and all over the country who has seen it on Reddit and found their way through
crook or hook whatever to the website and bought
the prints from you guys. Any suggestions about how? – Yep, yep, yep, yep. This is an easy one. You have a defined niche. You know this thing’s gonna sell when it gets in front of people’s eyeballs so the easiest way to do
this is interest targeting on Facebook people that
love Golden Retrievers. That’s where I would start, and it’s likely going to, it’s very possible this
could ROI very very easily, such that even if that person is not a particular expert at Facebook ads you can start with a small budget and keep an eye on your stats, see what happens to the add to carts. Follow up with the add to carts. Do some hand to hand combat there and you might be able to just get away with straight cold targeting on Facebook to people that love Golden Retrievers because anyone that has
a Golden Retriever knows that that dog will run until
its heart stops beating to chase that damn ball. I mean all day long, and so everyone that
looks at that painting and I made it full
screen so I could see it, knows instantaneously
what’s going on there. I know what’s going on there. That dog will just keep
running and running. You connect to that. That’s where I would start. – When you were at the Arboretum are you selling the
Golden Retriever content? – I have almost exclusively
Golden Retriever and dog content there. It’s a very small little piece. – You have other dogs as well. Other dog content as well. – I have one Pittbull
print, but that’s it. – Are you mainly selling
the Golden Retrievers when you’re out there? – Mainly, and I mean it was over the holidays and I sold $1,200 worth of stuff there and relatively small items, and then it’s still up but
it’s petered out since then. All right man. What I heard from you
Patrick was Facebook ads and SEOing the heck out of
the Golden Retriever deal and not going through dogspotting or Gold Ribbon Rescue. – There’s so many plays here. I could start rattling them off. Yes, I love the Facebook ads. Yes, I’m gonna go back to that guy that moderates the group that
slapped your cousin on the arm and be like have your cousin send a direct message to
the moderator of the forum and be like look dude,
you love this thing. Everybody loves this thing. Look how many shares it got. We’re willing to send you a free print. All we want is a link back. We’ll do a contest too, where you moderator, can auction off one of
these things to your group any which way you like. All we’re asking for is a
link back to the website. I would find every
single solitary dog group on the entire internet that worked and do it again and again
and again and again. Then I would go on Instagram
and I would follow the hashtags that have everything to
do with Golden Retrievers. I would find the accounts that are the biggest accounts in the United States. I would send a direct
message via Instagram. I know I’m going fast. It’s been a long day. Via Instagram to the person
that moderates that account and say look, you have a huge audience. You’re always looking for
good Golden Retriever content. I think this content is awesome. I will send you a print that you can give away to your audience. Would you be willing to
do that, yes or no? No? Don’t worry about it. Go to the next one. Go to the next one. Go to the next one. My guess is there’s probably upwards of 50 to 100, probably even 1,000
Instagram pages on Instagram that specialize in one aspect or another of Golden Retrievers. Every kind imaginable, and every little aspect of it imaginable and then after I’m done
with the big macro ones I’m gonna go down to the local level. There’s the California
Golden Retriever Club. There’s the Orange County
Golden Retriever Club. There’s the Austin Golden Retriever Club. I mean these things are all over the place and they’re having meetups. Every single solitary time I would knock the door down with hey, you’ve got a great big
community here. This is amazing. I tell you what. Look at this Ballhalla. I know, right. Chasing the ball. I will let you auction
this off to your community. No problem. Gives you some great content. All I’m asking in return is
a link back to my website and to be honest with you, I would maybe even start by doing that. You could get off the phone with me, pull out Instagram, type in the Golden Retriever hashtags, come back with a list
of 30 big size accounts and send them all direct messages tonight. You can send up to 50 a day until you get your wrist slapped by
the Instagram monitors, by the way. So send 30, 35 of them. 40 of them today, and just
say hey, here’s the print. I’m trying to grow it. I’ll give you one for free even because normally they’d
charge you to post. I’ll give you one for free and you can auction one
off to your community this is a no brainer, because they’re constantly
looking for ways to grow their Instagram community and they’re constantly looking for ways to keep their followers engaged. If they can’t enter the
best dog name below, wins this incredible print
Ballhalla by such and such. Done, done. – Okay, well I still want to get to you on bigger and other stuff, because I need my website
to start working for me. I just did my taxes last
year and my ROI on that is not making a whole lot of sense. I know you’re good. I know I’m good. Like I said, I haven’t even
begun to turn things on. We’ll save that for another day. – It’ll never be good, if you don’t actively do the marketing. It’s the fallacy is thinking
the website’s gonna do it. It’s truly a horse and a cart situation. It does not matter if
the website is a Ferrari. If it’s not hooked up to any horses, it’s not going anywhere. The horses is the marketing. It doesn’t matter if it’s
a Ferrari or it’s a Pinto or it’s a piece of wood. It’s not going anywhere
without the horses. – Gotcha. Nick, I’m at Link
and Ten Gallery on 6th Street if you can make it down there man. – What is it called? Lincoln what? – Link and Ten Gallery. – Oh okay, got it. – Small gallery on 6th street. We’d love to see you. – Cool. – Thanks guys. – Thank you. – See you. – Congrats, that thing’s awesome. Make me wanna. – I’m excited for you. I think you’ve got a lot of potential. You just gotta get out
there and do exactly. I don’t have to say anything else. Just do exactly what Pat said, and just follow what I’m saying about collect the leads. Everywhere you are going, because that’s your digital strategy. Like you’re gonna make sales and do everything you can everywhere else but you gotta collect the email addresses everywhere you are, as many as many as many as you can because with that, then you apply that, into the art marketing calendar. Everything we’re telling
you to do in there and that’s going to close people. That’s going to close
the sales eventually. It’s gonna grow your audience. It’s gonna amplify the whole thing, but you’ve gotta collect
the qualified leads. You’ve gotta find a way to do that and it’s like we were just talking to Abby a few minute ago about the gallery and I’m like, when I was telling her, people are coming in. The business, any business, has gotta collect leads. You gotta collect qualified leads, and if you’re not doing that, you have to stop doing
whatever you’re doing and go do something else, and then do something else, and do something else, until you find a faucet of qualified leads that’s coming in to you, and a faucet could be like, I use that terminology to say if you do a show, and every time you do that show, it’s generating you a couple of sales and 50 emails on your
list of qualified leads, that’s a little faucet that you got there. Maybe you can do some other shows. Maybe it’s doing some. Obviously the Facebook ads
that Pat’s talking about. Maybe the Instagram
followers or these groups. Everyone of those are individual faucets that can bring you qualified leads. So you wanna get every email address you possibly can while you’re obviously trying to make sales,
as the first priority. – Where do I find the
art marketing calendar? – When you’re logged into Art Storefronts and you’re working on your site, on the very top bar there’s a, it says marketing resources. Hover over that, and it’s all right there. It’ll say Art Marketing Calendar. You just click on it. It’ll take you right to it. – Thanks so much. – You got it. No problem. – Bye. – I think that’s it. I think we’ve exhausted all the questions. – Let’s wrap it up anyways, because it’s getting late, and then we’ll save anybody
else for the next time. It doesn’t look like any hands are raised. – We still have 30 participants. Thanks everyone for sticking
through that with us. Had no idea where that would go. It was actually really fun. I hope it was helpful. I certainly had fun. – Yeah me too. I’m excited for all of you guys. We’re gonna be doing this. I think this last part, is the part that we’ll
be doing more frequently. Maybe on a weekly basis. Maybe on a monthly basis. We’ll figure that out. We’ll talk to you guys. You guys give us some feedback, and work on these things, and then let’s keep working. Something that’s really
important to know guys, when you’re growing a business, and this is why, this gets to the point of why I created the Art
Storefronts, this product, is when you’re at zero in sales, and you’re trying to get to traction, you’re gonna get stuck. You gotta try different things, and then oh my gosh,
you get some traction, but then you get to $10,000 in sales, and then everything just stops again, and you’re going oh my gosh, what do I do? I just stopped again, and then you’ve gotta get some advice. You gotta figure out what’s going on there because maybe one of the channels that you have working, one of the marketing channels, that’s been delivering for you, one of your faucets, you can’t push it any further. It’s the last show you can do or it’s something else, and you’ve gotta move to the next level. You kind of get stuck there. Well, you’re gonna probably
get stuck at $100,000 in sales. The same problem, right, and then you’re like
how do I get to $500,000 or $1,000,000? It never ends guys. Working on a business. It’s never just you try one thing and then all of a sudden, the sea parts, and you
walk right through it, and it’s woo, this is amazing! Never works that way. Doesn’t matter what level you’re at. We’re here to help you
work on the business. No matter where you’re at. I don’t want you guys getting stuck at all so just keep that in your minds. Keep coming back to these things. Let’s keep working through your problems and let’s get you moving forward. All right guys? Thank you. – Thanks everybody. Bye.

7 Comments

  • Clyde Gagnon says:

    Sorry I missed the call but thank you for posting

  • Scott Kemper says:

    Great stuff guys! I heard this was coming. Never got any notice of this unless it was only announced on Small Wins and I missed it. Anyway, thanks for recording and sharing. I always need the inspiration and the push.

  • Ben Asen says:

    Where are all the people?

  • Marie Stephens Art says:

    Thanks for doing this. It was really good to hear the voices of other artists who have many of the same questions I have had along this journey. Especially the last one with the dogs, as that is about 50% of what my art is focused on.

  • Garcia Thomas says:

    Great information Nick & Pat! I’m not feeling as stuck anymore and will definitely try some of your suggestions. Thanks for reposting the broadcast .🎨

  • Tim says:

    nice content it was really entertaining

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